H G Moorcroft b. 1899 - WW1 record found

[sladefinder]

My late Grandfather Henry Grosvenor Moorcroft was (according to my Mum's recollections) in the Royal Engineers.

Last night I found a record which I believe relates to him in the 'UK, Absent Voter Lists, 1918-1925, 1939'

Name: Hy Grosvener Moorcroft
Rank: Pnr
Electoral Date: 1918
Electoral Place: Erdington, Birmingham, England
Branch of Service or British Army Corps: Royal Engineers
Regiment: TIF Sig Co
Service Number: 281727

This information then led me to find a record on the Forces-war-records website, of Henry being admitted to 'Brickett House' in Feb 1918 for 17 days with influenza. I'm fairly sure this is him despite the initials on the transcribed information being shown as 'HS' - the 'S' could be a wrongly transcribed 'G'.

The full details of the record are:

First Name: H S
Surname: Moorcroft
Age: 18
Index Number of Admission: 160
Information: Service in the Command 10 months.
Rank: Pioneer
Service Number: 281727
Years Service: 10 months
Ailment: Influenza
Date of Admission for Original Ailment: 05/02/1918
Date Discharged Back to Duty: 21/02/1918
Number of Days Under Treatment: 17
Number/Designation of Ward: Brickett House
Religion: Church of England
Regiment: Royal Engineers
Battalion: N. Army - 'N. Army'???
Other unit info: Signals

Archive Reference:
MH106/1527 MH106/1527 can be found at The National Archives in Kew, and contains First World War Representative Medical Records of Middlesex War Hospital: 21/11/1917 to 03/11/1918. United Kingdom Force. The County of Middlesex War Hospital, Napsbury, St Albans. Book 3. Ser: 1907-2046, Tr: 429-435 (1917). Ser: 1-1040 Tr: 1-69 (1918).

I'm very excited to find these 2 records and I want to find more or to get more information from the wealth of knowledge via the folks on these forums.

How/where can I find out more information with the details I've included above?

Can anyone provide me any details about the TIF Sig Co? I have tried googling but the results mostly consist of Tiffany jewellers! I believe they were signallers, but where can I find more about them or any online records about their activities?
Henry was a 'Pnr' rank - a Pioneer - would this be a rank he would have worked his way towards, or would he have been given that rank when he enlisted?

Henry was in the Home Guard during WW2, where would I find records online for them?

Any information would be very much appreciated, thank you in anticipation.

[christanel]

Welcome to the British-Genealogy forums
As you have come to us from Forces War records reading this will explain the connection.
It is a very lucky person who finds a WW1 service record for their ancestor because more than 60% of these were destroyed by bombing/fire/water damage in WW11
The Medal Index card records do survive and also the Medal and Award records but using the service number you gave without a surname none of them produce a Henry Grosvenor Moorcroft or variants of the name.
Only ancestry and Findmypast (both pay per view sites) are licensed to hold the WW1 service records and I can't see one for your man. Neither can I find the Medal Roll Index card for him, also trying different combinations of name and service number.
I will keep looking but just wanted you to know we are on the case.
Christina

[christanel]

A Maureen Dickson has a public tree on ancestry.co.uk and has a photo of Henry G in uniform but there is no reference to his army record in the sources.
ancestry has a free library version, it may be worth your while asking if your local library has it. Not sure if you can access public trees on the free version though.
Christina

[simmo1]

Hi

If he did not serve overseas, he will have no MIC, and if his service records have been destroyed, that is all you will have unfortunately.

regards

Robert

[christanel]

According to Wikipedia
A pioneer is a soldier employed to perform engineering and construction tasks. The term is in principle similar to sapper. Pioneers were originally part of the artillery branch of European armies. Subsequently, they formed part of the engineering branch, the logistic branch, part of the infantry; or even comprised a branch in their own right.


This would fit with Henry G's occupation on the 1939 register where he gives his occupation as
Auto - Mechanical & Electrical Engineer.
The National Archives research guide for the home guard is here and it gives a link to where you can order the service records. You will need death certificate, 30 pounds and a patience while you wait a while for delivery if you decide to go ahead.


I am frustrated by the lack of records for WW1 but as your grandfather only joined in 1918 this, along with the destruction of records, may account for it.
Christina

[sladefinder]

Christina,

Thank you so much for your very informative and helpful replies. I'll try to cover various points you mention in all of your replies, in this one post.
Like you, I have also checked the Medal Index card records on a number of occasions (I often have an active subscription on Ancestry - as I do currently) but have not found him sadly.
The photo you saw on Maureen Dickson's Ancestry public tree is the photo I uploaded years ago to my Ancestry tree!

The lack of WW1 records is very disappointing and frustrating as you say.

I believe Henry joined up in March/April 1917 as the medical admission in Feb 1918 states years of service - 10 months. I also found some information about 'Bricket House' (spelt or transcribed wrongly as 'Brickett' in the form) on Google Books:
'St Albans: Life on the Home Front, 1914-1918'



I would like to find some details of where Henry's unit were based as it seems he would have been near Bricket House. Maybe I'll look at the British Newspaper Archive site.

I'm not sure it'll be worth my while obtaining his Home Guard service as the National Archives information states:
'Information contained within the Home Guard records is very limited. With a few exceptions it normally consists of one double sided A4 sheet of paper (Army Form W3066) containing personal details on enlistment and very little else. No details are held of the duties performed by an individual during his service.' Though the eternal optimist in me is focused on the 'With a few exceptions' part, maybe Henry might be one of those exceptions!

I was watching Antiques Roadshow on TV last night, they did a WW1 special. The Spanish Flu pandemic started in January 1918 apparently, so I'm wondering if Henry's 'Influenza' was actually Spanish Flu. If that was the case he did well to recover from such a devastating illness that claimed so many lives worldwide.

I very much appreciate all of the information you've provided Christina and if any other avenues I could explore spring to mind please let me know. Meanwhile I will try the British Newspaper Archive and hope that uncovers something more. I'll update this thread if/when I find more out.

[sladefinder]

Robert and/or Christina,

Do you know what 'T.I.F' means on Henry's UK Absent Voters document? I'm thinking the T could stand for territorial?

[simmo1]

Hi

I have searched for T.I.F. in a lot of places, nothing comes up anywhere.
I wonder if it is possible mistranslation from an original hand-written form?
I know with my Grandfather, his wedding form has a misleading entry for his battalion (married in 1917).
regards

Robert