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  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by almach View Post
    Could this be your grandparents marriage in Manchester?

    Marriages Dec 1948, vol 10e, page 620
    Lilian M W...... and Cyril G P W........... (I can't publish their surnames in case they are still living), but you can find the marriage yourself here: FreeBMD (if you aren't familiar with the site, Google.

    If you ascertain it is the correct marriage come back to us and we can then try to take you further back.
    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Wilson View Post
    If you have any of your Cocking's appearing in Chesterfield area, I know of someone there who has researched the name.
    Hi thanks Neil. I'm not sure all i know is that the Cockings family from Newlyn was my mum aunt. I'd love to trace them and find our who they all were. I don't know anything about the Whitfords either my mum's memory is great so im trying to get any little info as i can to build a tree. x

  2. #12
    Super Moderator almach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theresa B View Post
    Hi yes the Lillian and Cyril are correct they are my mum's parents both passed away now and I know my grandad Cyril was from Liverpool but im not sure where about in Cornwall Lillian was born and I just know Lillians mum was Lily Whitford she has to of been born in the 1900. Sybil cocking could be a connection somewhere down the line.
    Ok Theresa, thank you. I'll get on to the search now and see what I can find to take you further back
    Alma

  3. #13
    Super Moderator almach's Avatar
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    Starting with the registration of your grandparents marriage.
    Marriages Dec 1948, Manchester vol 10e page 620
    Whitford Lilian M
    Williams Cyril G P

    This seems to be your granfather's birth reg.
    Births Mar 1920, Williams Cyril G P, mother's maiden name PERRIS, W.Derby 8b 1296
    Alma

  4. #14
    Super Moderator almach's Avatar
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    Oh. oh, has turned out more complicated than I'd hoped. So, I looked for a tree on Ancestry, found one which seems to be yours, Theresa, am I right? The tree has Cyril's parents as Lucy Perris born abt 1884 Birkenhead and Samuel Williams born? Hudson Bay, Canada. No marriage recorded on the tree and I couldn't find a marriage for the couple either. However, the tree has Frederick W Perris as Lucy's father.

    Marriage
    9 Nov 1909, Toxteth, St Clement, Lancashire
    Herbert Cecil Mortimer Andrew, 24yrs, chief steward, 40, Smithdown Rd, father Herbert Leo Andrew, gentleman
    Lucy Perris, 24yrs, 40, Smithdown Rd, father FREDERICK WILLIAM PERRIS, clerk.
    Witnesses: Norman and Edith McIver.

    Marriages Mar 1917
    ANDREW Lucy / Williams Samuel, W. Derby 8b 732

    So, it appears Samuel Williams is Lucy's second husband.

    More to follow.
    Alma

  5. #15
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    Lucy Andrew, a widow, is on the 1911 census, age 26, born Birkenhead, living 53 Blythswood St, Birkenhead. I haven't found a death for Herbert, a tree on Ancestry has his death as Jan 1910 but no source to back it up.

    Lucy appears on various Liverpool crew lists working as a stewardess 1911/12
    Alma

  6. #16
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    Taking Lucy Perris further back.

    1901, RG13; Piece: 3503; Folio: 157; Page: 70

    Frederick W Perris 47, widower, clerk (steamer ship) St Helens
    Frederick Perris 14, shop boy, Plumstead Kent
    Lucy Perris 16, milliner, Birkenhead
    Mary Ann Busher 34, servant (probably the lady who becomes Frederick's 2nd wife see #18)

    1891, Liverpool, RG12; Piece: 2910; Folio: 20; Page: 4

    Frederick W Perris 30, commercial traveller, St Helens
    Maria I Perris 26, Toxteth Park
    Frederick W Perris 4, Woolwich Kent
    Thomas R Meadows 28, boarder

    Lucy is with her grandparents in Wavertree in 1891, RG12; Piece: 3002; Folio: 52; Page: 12
    Robert Perris 60, accountant, Lancashire
    Martha B Perris 61, St Helens
    Lucy Perris 25, Garston
    Robert Perris 21, account clerk, Lancashire
    Lucy 6, grand dau, Birkenhead
    Alma

  7. #17
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    1881, 162 Falkner Street. Liverpool. RG11; Piece: 3625; Folio: 55; Page: 12
    Robert Perris 51, accountant iron works, Liverpool
    Martha B. Perris 52, St Helens
    Frederick W. Perris 26, timekeeper at iron works, St Helens
    Walter Perris 23,comm clerk unemployed, Halewood
    Julia B. Perris 21, milliner, Garston
    Herbert Perris 19, engine fitter iron works, Garston
    Alfred Perris 18, engine fitter iron works, Garston
    Lucy B. Perris 16, Garston
    Robert Perris 11, Garston
    Alma

  8. #18
    Super Moderator almach's Avatar
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    Back to Frederick William

    1911, 22 Abyssinia St Liverpool,
    Frederick Wm Perris 54, checker, docks, St Helens
    Mary Ann Perris 44, Liverpool (2nd wife)
    Frederick Wm Perris 25, labourer paint works, Plumstead Kent

    1st marriage
    Mar 31st 1884, Holy Trinity Liverpool
    Frederick William Perris, 26yrs, bachelor, clerk, 20, Springfield, father Robert a bookeeper
    Maria Jane Green, 20yrs, spinster, 20, Springfield, father: William Purdue? Green a labourer
    Witnesses: Thomas Hargrave and Sarah Hargrave

    2nd marriage
    June 3rd 1906, St Michaels, Toxteth
    Frederick William Perris, 48yrs, widower, timber measurer, 8, Tramway Rd, father Robert, gentleman
    Mary Ann Busher, 37yrs, spinster, 8, Tramway Rd, father John deceased
    Witnesses: William Hy Roberts and George Clingan
    Alma

  9. #19
    Super Moderator almach's Avatar
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    I cannot find a birth for Lily/Lillian/Lilian M Whitford in Cornwall within the timeframe. Nor can I find her on the 1939 register in any county. I'm wondering if she wasn't born Whitford? Could she too have been married previously, or she was born ????? but known as Whitford which perhaps was a stepfather's name? I'm clutching at straws as Lil* Whitford born Cornwall is elusive. Perhaps someone else will have more luck finding her. I'll pick up the baton again later, meanwhile ask your Mum if she can remember any other information which may help to find Lilian, perhaps your Mum knows where she was living in 1939??

    Does your Mum know Lilian's father's name, or anything about him? It's odd because I can't find either Lilian or Cyril on the 1939 register, do you know where they met?

    Could this be your grandmother's death registration, if so her birth date may help to pin her down.
    Lilian May Williams, Age: 67, Dec 1993, Manchester
    Birth Date: 19 Jun 1926
    Register Number: C52B
    District and Subdistrict: 0061C

    Got a possible birth reg now, but her mum doesn't appear to be married as her maiden name is also Whitford, which generally indicates an unmarried woman, unless a Whitford married a Whitford.

    Births Jun 1926, Whitford Lilian, mother's maiden name Whitford Penzance 5c 322

    We really could do with finding Lilian in 1939.
    Alma

  10. #20
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    Robert Perris baptism 1829 with parents names
    Baptism: 17 Aug 1829 St Peter, Liverpool, Lancashire, England
    Robert Perris - [Child] of John Perris & Elizabeth
    Abode: Trowbridge St
    Occupation: Book Keeper
    Baptised by: William Tyrer Offg. Minister
    Register: Baptisms 1829 - 1830, Page 38, Entry 299
    Source: LDS Film 93878
    added
    their last child baptism in 1844 shows John as Librarian in Liverpool Library - Robert was the second of 6 children - their 5th child was Frederick Perris

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