Missing death index and certificate

[battista]

I've hit a brick wall, I'm trying to find my 3rd Great Grandfather Giovanni Battista's death index (eventually to order the certificate).

Some general information about him:

Given name(s): Giovanni
Surname: Battista
Birthdate: 19 May 1847
Birthplace: Rocca d'Arce, Frosinone, Lazio, Italy
Alternative Birthplace: Cassino, Frosinone, Lazio, Italy
Occupation: Tailor/Ice Cream Vendor/Street Organ Proprietor
Estimated date of death: 1901 - 1910
Name of spouse at death: Anastatia Finley Whalan (Battista)

England Census Info

Place of residence 1901: Tynemouth, Northumberland, England
Place of residence 1891: North Shields, Northumberland, England
Place of residence 1881: Newcastle on Tyne All Sts, Northumberland, England

Other Info

Two of his children's marriage entries list his name as "John Battista" (Giovanni is John in Italian), one marriage in 1910 states he is deceased.

Since he is alive in the 1901 census, but listed as deceased in his child's marriage in 1910 and does not appear in the 1911 census, he must have died between 1901 and 1910. Here is my 2nd Great Grandfather's marriage from 1910, listing his father as deceased: https://i.imgur.com/Mwq6o2t.jpg

I can not find him in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1837-1915. I was not able to find his wife in any future censuses. However, I did find her death index in 1934.

What I have searched:

• GRO index, FreeBMD, ancestry.co.uk, FamilySearch, North Tyneside Council online records, Sunderland Council online records, Northumberland Council online records & Newcastle Council online records.

• All Battista (and misspellings/phonetically similar names) death records from 1899 to 1922 throughout England. None of which match the age at death between those years +/- 5 years. None of which match any variations or misspellings of his name.

• Gravestone websites for his name.

• England and Wales will search - GOV.UK

I've also requested a manual search from 1900 - 1911 from the North Tyneside Registrars (who are responsible for record keeping in the regions Giovanni lived in, in his last two censuses). They were not able to find his death but did find his first wife's death in 1900 (Elizabeth); he was listed as the spouse and reporter.

I will be requesting manual searches of records from Newcastle, Northumberland and Sunderland.

It's looking a lot like his death wasn't registered at all in England. FreeBMD and GRO index searches for only the surname Battista and phonetic variations (no given names entered) from 1900 - 1922 throughout England result in no names or death ages that are close. I've found his children's death indexes, even his brother who died in 1900. I'm running out of ideas; any help would be much appreciated.

[Jomot1]

I know the age is out by a lot and the death is also after 1911, but have you definitely ruled out the 1915 death in Chelsea? I can't see this man anywhere in the 1911 census, or any earlier one come to that.

[battista]

I know the age is out by a lot and the death is also after 1911, but have you definitely ruled out the 1915 death in Chelsea? I can't see this man anywhere in the 1911 census, or any earlier one come to that.

He's in the 1881, 1891 and 1901 census.

I don't know if you'll be able to see this, but here's my ancestry.com profile of him: https://www.ancestry.com/family-tree...02756595/facts

FamilySearch profile (less complete/accurate): https://www.familysearch.org/tree/pe...tails/L89K-DR7

I saw the Chelsea entry for a Giovani Batista, not ruled out completely. I do know that there are cases of deaths being registered years after they occurred. I will likely order that death certificate from GRO. 55 is the death age, which is one year more than his last age at 1901 census. This is just the age of death, so if he died in 1911-1912 and was only registered in 1915, this could indeed be the case.

[Jomot1]

Sorry, it was the Chelsea Giovani I meant when I said I couldn't find him in any census. The one in London in 1911 died in 1931, so it's not him.

[battista]

Ah, I see. Increases the chances that it is the Giovanni I'm looking for, just a late death registration. If Chelsea Giovani's only record is his death, that still leaves that record a possibility. I'm glad you ruled out the London one.

Although ~13 years is quite a long death registration delay.

[Jomot1]

I doubt that a death registration would be anywhere near that long. As far as I'm aware deaths should be notified within 5-days. I think there are special rules in certain circumstances, but registration that late would be exceptional and would need special permission from the Registrar General.

The one in Chelsea may well be someone else entirely, but I guess there's only one way to know for sure. It would help if Anastatia could be found in 1911, but she's hiding herself very well!