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  1. #1
    janeygee
    Guest

    Smile Haddifin,Headifen,Hadifont Irish ancestors

    Here I am again seeking help or ideas to find my Irish Rellies,I've been researching them for years and can't seem to break down that big wall.I wonder if it may be due to the various name spellings of this unusual name.My search has included Ireland where I was told the name died out around 1900 in County Down and moved to Westmeath with a new spelling of course,and now there are tons of them with the new name,I'll never find them there.I do have a small bunch in Glasgow and can trace them to USA,and
    brave wee soul James Haddifan son of Edward and Rebecca McMillan Haddifan,he sailed to Aust.settled in NZ and there are tons of descendants from him but all have the name Headifen.
    Now what I seek is why the family is on the 1841 Census Barony Parish but the older parents died off by the 1851 Census,so now ask can anyone tell me if there is a possible Electorial Register or any other collection of records I can view to find what happened to them all.I have been on Ancestry,FMP,etc,etc and all just give me the same info I already have,I know where they came from in Ireland but not when they arrived in Glasgow.They were all Weavers etc so is their any occupation or site I can view there.I am stumped and am grateful for any ideas, tips, from members,so very sorry this request is so long-winded.appreciate your patience,thanks a bunch.

    Kind regards
    Janey

  2. #2

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    If the family is in Barony by the time of the 1841 census, then they arrived before then. There was no formal immigration procedure between Scotland and Ireland then, so for earlier entries your best bet would be to search the Barony parish registers. Were they Catholics? There are a few Catholic registers available now, as well as the Church of Scotland and other denominations. You need Scotlands People - open an account if you don't already have one and then you can search their indexes for free. You need to buy, and spend, credits to download copies of the actual entries.
    You will find a collection of sources and how-to articles at the top of the General Scottish forum HERE. I suggest that you read them, they may give you some ideas.

    Variation of name spelling was almost a national sport in Scotland back then - you spoke your name to the Clerk or Minister and he wrote what he heard. Assuming they had Irish accents, much is possible and he would not have asked them to check his entry.

    Have you looked for the children in the 1851? Death certificates started in Scotland in 1855, and you can often find people who spent most of their lives in the 18th and early 19th centuries but managed to live to 1855 or just after.

    Bear in mind that people may have moved within Scotland, into England, or even have returned to Ireland, depending on where work was available.

  3. #3

    Default

    Am I correct in thinking that the Haddifin family in the 1841 was:
    Peter 87, Agnes 75, William 40, Rose 34, John 10, Margaret 6, Agnes 3?

    ie Grandparents, parents and children?

    All 3 children are shown on the census as having been born in Lanarkshire, so the family must have arrived before 1831.

    I must admit that I can't find them in the 1851.

    There is a member's tree relating to this family on Ancestry. The owner doesn't seem to have got any further.

  4. #4
    janeygee
    Guest

    Post Irish Rellies

    HI LESLEY,

    I've just been recheckin all the posts after much delay I realise I never answered your nice reply,
    I did take your advice and bought Forty Credits at a cost of Ten Pounds which was a lot more in dollars
    but I did not mind as I had all the rellies: in various names and I thought it would be a
    piece of cake but I used up most of my credits in the first fifteen minutes and found out nothing that I did not already know needless to say I am very disappointed in Scotlands People and
    I don't think I will be going on there again.
    Also on S/P when I put in the family name with spelling as shown the index comes up as Sorry no Record yet the same people are on the census and up comes the census page,,,what gives
    with this site. I'm wondering where I can access the Barony Parish records as that is where
    they all lived,Also is there an Occupation site for Weavers anywhere,,,

    Appreciate any ideas and help you can provide,,thanks a bunch,,
    Kind regards
    Janey

  5. #5
    Knowledgeable and helpful
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Co. Antrim, Northern Ireland
    Posts
    629

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    Janey,

    You haven’t answered the all important question Lesley asked about the family’s denomination. Do you know what they were? It’s really important because you are looking for records before statutory birth registration in both Scotland (1855) and Ireland (1864) so you need to search church records. And to do that you need to have the right denomination. The bad news is that most of the relevant Scottish records are on Scotlandspeople.

    There’s no occupational site for weavers, at least not one with lists of them. (There were weavers guilds and some of their records do survive but I don't think they are on-line. I used some in NRS in Edinburgh some years ago but they were only in paper format then). Half the rural population were weavers. It’s what they did if there was no labouring work available. In the early part of the 1800s it was hand loom weaving on portable weaving machines in your home (such as are still used in the Outer Hebrides to make Harris Tweed) but as the century progressed hand loom weavers in both Scotland & Ireland were gradually displaced by water powered mechanized mills that made material (Linen, cotton, calico etc) much more quickly, cheaply and to a better standard. If you want a little background about weavers in Ireland, this site may help:

    https://www.fergusonsirishlinen.com/...e1=About-Linen
    ELWYN

  6. #6
    Knowledgeable and helpful
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Parbold, Lancashire
    Posts
    822

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by janeygee View Post
    I did take your advice and bought Forty Credits at a cost of Ten Pounds which was a lot more in dollars
    but I did not mind as I had all the rellies: in various names and I thought it would be a
    piece of cake but I used up most of my credits in the first fifteen minutes and found out nothing that I did not already know needless to say I am very disappointed in Scotlands People and
    I don't think I will be going on there again.
    Also on S/P when I put in the family name with spelling as shown the index comes up as Sorry no Record yet the same people are on the census and up comes the census page,,,what gives
    with this site.
    Don't despair, Janey. You have to be creative when searching on Scotland's People.

    Searching HEADIFEN on SP, using the basic search, throws up 27 results. As well as 18 census results for 1841, 1851 and 1871, there are 2 deaths in statutory registers and 1 baptism, 1 death and 3 marriages in parish registers.

    Still using HEADIFEN, underneath the surname box there is a 'search options' button. Click on that and choose 'fuzzy matching', then 'update results'. Now you should have 180 results across all four categories. Scroll through them and you will find the names HEADIFON, HADDIFEN, HEDDIFON, HEADAFIN, HEADEFIN, HEDEFEN, HADIFEN, HADIFIEN, HADIFIN and HEDIFIN. There may be more!

    You can also try other name search options, just in case there are some others tucked away.

    Peter

  7. #7
    janeygee
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Elwyn Soutter View Post
    Janey,

    You haven’t answered the all important question Lesley asked about the family’s denomination. Do you know what they were? It’s really important because you are looking for records before statutory birth registration in both Scotland (1855) and Ireland (1864) so you need to search church records. And to do that you need to have the right denomination. The bad news is that most of the relevant Scottish records are on Scotlandspeople.

    There’s no occupational site for weavers, at least not one with lists of them. (There were weavers guilds and some of their records do survive but I don't think they are on-line. I used some in NRS in Edinburgh some years ago but they were only in paper format then). Half the rural population were weavers. It’s what they did if there was no labouring work available. In the early part of the 1800s it was hand loom weaving on portable weaving machines in your home (such as are still used in the Outer Hebrides to make Harris Tweed) but as the century progressed hand loom weavers in both Scotland & Ireland were gradually displaced by water powered mechanized mills that made material (Linen, cotton, calico etc) much more quickly, cheaply and to a better standard. If you want a little background about weavers in Ireland, this site may help:

    https://www.fergusonsirishlinen.com/...e1=About-Linen
    HI ELWYN

    Sorry I missed the question from Lesley,to the best of my knoledge the Irish rellies were all Presbyterian,I do have one of the girls Betty/Elizabeth name spelling Haddovan she born same as brother Edward Blaris parish,Cty Down, she married in a civil service then a Catholic church to Francis Murray, but I figured the rest of them most were married Scots/Presb as they are on the 1841 Census
    and you guy's I think said they must have arrived from Ireland around 1831.They all worked in the weaving trade,some Power Loom
    some Dresser,,,I am so grateful for any help finding these rellies , my Grt Granfather came down the line from them and ended with my Mother,I have the info on both of them with Cert's,

    I will have a look on that Linen site,thanks a bunch,

    Kind regards
    Janey

  8. #8
    janeygee
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by elsinore View Post
    Don't despair, Janey. You have to be creative when searching on Scotland's People.

    Searching HEADIFEN on SP, using the basic search, throws up 27 results. As well as 18 census results for 1841, 1851 and 1871, there are 2 deaths in statutory registers and 1 baptism, 1 death and 3 marriages in parish registers.

    Still using HEADIFEN, underneath the surname box there is a 'search options' button. Click on that and choose 'fuzzy matching', then 'update results'. Now you should have 180 results across all four categories. Scroll through them and you will find the names HEADIFON, HADDIFEN, HEDDIFON, HEADAFIN, HEADEFIN, HEDEFEN, HADIFEN, HADIFIEN, HADIFIN and HEDIFIN. There may be more!

    You can also try other name search options, just in case there are some others tucked away.

    Peter
    WOW thanks Peter for that info I will get on to S/P and check em out,,will get back at ya with any good results I find,,,,
    thanks a bunch,,,

    Kind regards
    Janey

  9. #9
    Knowledgeable and helpful
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Co. Antrim, Northern Ireland
    Posts
    629

    Default

    Janey,

    Blaris is the parish around the modern city of Lisburn. The main Presbyterian church there, certainly pre 1850, is 1st Lisburn. Their records start in 1688. So might be worth searching them for your family. I don’t know if they are on-line anywhere, but if not there’s a copy in PRONI in Belfast. A personal visit is required to view them. Those records contain:

    Baptisms, 1692-1732, 1736-64 and 1779-1927; marriages, 1688-96, 1711-1718/19 and 1782-1975; communion rolls, c.1863 and 1886-96; statistics about families in the congregation, 1863; session minutes, 1688-1709,1711-63 and 1888-1965, which include discipline cases, 1805-24 and 1854-87; committee minutes, 1846-1947;subscription list for the new meeting house,1764-5; seat lists and pew rents, 1764- 1824; accounts, 1775-1817.

    The area around Lisburn was noted for its involvement in the Linen industry. Lots of weavers came from that area. Lisburn even has a linen weaving museum:

    https://www.lisburnmuseum.com
    ELWYN

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