William SERLE b btw 1785 and 1788

[janbooth]

The birth/baptismal record in the parish register of Stoke Damarel in 1843/4 states that Alfred John SERLE was the son of William & Mary, Cordwainer. However, the only Alfred (John) SERLE born c1843/4 in Devonport on subsequent census records show him to be the son of Alfred & Eliza SERLE so perhaps the incumbent just made a mistake - it has been known! This is corroborated by the National Probate Calendar record for Alfred SERLE who died 26 November 1888, a Storeman of Mount Street, wherein one of the Executors was shown as Alfred John SERLE, Professor of Music, the son of said deceased.

As regards the Will of William snr, it may not show very much more than the details in the Probate Calendar as the record only states that Letters of Administration were granted to William jnr, not that the Will was actually proved. Sorry, I didn't check fully what the Calendar said. However, if you do want to purchase a Will post 1858 in future, you can go to the website probatesearch.service.gov.uk which will enable you to search and then order a copy.

Janet

[Geoff1959]

Hi Devonmade,
Thank you for this. I do remember finding these earlier and discounted them for some reason.
There is an Alfred Serle b 6 Dec 1815 in Kingsand (Think this is on the Rame penisular?) Could this be a later child from the William and Mary above? One other possibility is that this the same William and Mary that show up in Devonport a few years later. The problem with that is that William (jnr) was b c 1812 Devonport where as Alfred a later child was born in Kingsand.
Unforunately the baptism transcripts do not have that level of info. Is it possible to see the church records? I suppose we need to know or find out which church? Anybody have any thoughts?

[Devonmade]

The OPC (Genealogy) for Rame is Robert Sandford who may be worth contacting https://www.opc-cornwall.org/Par_new/q_s/rame.php
I have family in the same area and it seems they were very mobile. It is not far by ferry from Cremyll to Stonehouse. The coastal path is quite easy to walk today and I expect they walked a lot more in those days than we do. The other children were baptised in Rame church but there is also another church at Maker. Kingsand and Cawsand are in the middle but not very large even today.

[Geoff1959]

Thank you all for your replies.
I have e-mailed Robert Sandford so hopefully he can help.
Janet - with refernce to the census records Alfred (John) Serle b 1843 Stoke D was the son of (I believe) Alfred Serle & Eliza Paine
There is a baptism record for an Alfred 6 Dec 1815 in Kingsand.
I have been unable to find any marriage or burial records for Rame or any neighbouring parishes for William and Mary.

There is a baptism record for a William and Mary Serle - 3 children baptised in Rame
1808 Rame Mary SERLE William/ Mary
1808 Rame Ann SERLE William /Mary
1810 Rame Henry SERLE William/ Mary
I do have a William Serle btw 1785-1788 in Devonport and Mary Whitaker b 1785 Stoke Damerel

Married 1805 St. George East Stonehouse.

They have children born 1812, 1821, and 1824 and maybe Alfred in 1815.
Could this be the same William and Mary that I have above?
Date wise this is possible as she was married at 20
1st 2 children 1808 Mary + Ann (23)
3rd child 1810 Henry (25)
4th child 1812 William (jnr) (27)
5th child 1815 Alfred (30)
6th child 1821 George (36)
7th child 1824 Lavinia (39)

There is a death of a Mary Serle 1827 in Stoke Damerel. [Is seven children unusual over 19 years?]
The other thing that may help is that children 4 – 7 were baptised at Morice st. Wesleyan chapel.
Does this make the others children to be less likely to be of the same family as Rame is Anglican?
Maybe there are some things that I will never get a definitive answer to.

As always your help thoughts and knowledge much appreciated.

[Geoff1959]

Hi Devonmade,
Robert did some searching for me but was unable to find anything that we did not already have.
He did say that new stuff is coming to light all the time and he would let me know if there was anything.
It does seem that at the moment anyway there is a brick wall.
I'll turn my attention to other branches so no doubt I'll be back with other questions.
Thanks once again to all who helped.

[Geoff1959]

Hello,
Can anbody help me break down this "brick wall"? Everything has come to a dead stop with William Serle (snr).
The earliest supporting evidence for William is the 1851 census recorded as William Leale b Devonport aged 62 living at 31 Mount Street. He appears in the 1861 census as William Serle aged 75 widower living with his son William (jnr) and wife at 8 Bakers Place, Richmond Terrace.
I have found a marriage (that fits) to a Mary Whitaker 20th Jan 1805 East Stonehouse.
The thing is that I cannot find him on the 1841 and there is no evidence of him before 1851.
The 1851 and 1861 show his pob as Devonport but I cant find a baptism for him. DFHS dont seem to have anything on him either.
Anybody any ideas?

Regards,
Geoff1959

[wimsey]

a William SEARL baptised 1789, Bickleigh near Plymouth to Edward & Mary

[Geoff1959]

Thank you I'll take a look

[wimsey]

sorry, just realised he'd be too young to be marrying in 1805

[janbooth]

For anyone who is trying to help Geoff with his query, there is already a thread on this subject started on 25 January this year which details what information has already been found - perhaps the Mods can merge the 2 threads so we don't duplicate research??

Janet