WW1: Identifying location from an APO address

[thewideeyedowl]

I am trying to identify the exact location of an Army Post Office address in 1917. I'm sure this must be possible but searches to date have not thrown up the answer. Grrh...

The address is: AOC APO58, BEF France. The postcard is dated 26 Jan 1917:

.

Unfortunately (from my point of view) this card was sent, along with five others, all in one envelope. The envelope does not survive, nor do the other postcards. So I have no postmark for clues. The card was sent by my grandfather, Walter George Ezard, to his sister.

This post relates to my thread on the AOC: https://www.british-genealogy.com/th...=EZARD+and+AOC. I'm trying to establish what my grandfather might have been doing and where he might have been doing it. No service records have survived, hence the need for detective work.

Incidentally. there has been an interesting discussion on the Army Post Office service in WW1 on the Great War Forum:
https://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/fo...-post-offices/.

Hope someone will be able to help with this specific query. Thank you!

Owl

[simmo1]

Hi Owl

I wonder if these may be the one's to contact about your query - https://www.postalheritage.org.uk/exp...firstworldwar/ ?
Cant find anything specific.

regards

Robert

[thewideeyedowl]

Hi Robert - thank you.

Interesting reading and the more I read, the more complicated it gets. There is also an article in Wikipedia (of course...) entitled 'History of the British Army Postal Service', and then there is this informative site: https://www.worldwar1postcards.com/soldiers-mail.php

So I now know that there were Base Army Post Offices (BAPO) - in France they were numbered 1 to 4 (Le Havre, Rouen, Boulogne, Calais). Then there were Army Post Offices (APO), which are described as 'stationary', and located on lines of communications and rear areas. And, finally, the Field Post Offices (FPO) - self-explanatory. But nowhere is there a simple list of the numbers and location. It would be so useful if someone somewhere could compile one.

I have only three clues to my grandfather's location: a newly-discovered note by his sister saying that he sailed for Le Havre in mid-December 1916, an anecdote from my grandmother that he was "not robust" and served "well behind the lines", and finally a pro forma Discharge letter (from 1919, presumably) signed by the Base Commandant, HQ Dieppe. So that all points to a posting in or near the base depots on the French coast. But where was he? And where was APO58?

Off to roost now.

Owl

[Kiltpin]

This probably has no bearing what so ever, but as I have just found it and think it is too valuable to disregard - https://www.1914-1918.net/hospitals.htm

Regards

Kiltpin

[timbo58]

I believe APO numbers/designations were 'scrambled' later in WWI as it became obvious that any mail captured by the enemy could reveal the regiment/battalions location by the APO number.

Therefore any earlier APO designation list that may survive wouldn't help with anything later.
I seem to recall there's a number of large folders/books at Kew in the reading room with all of these numbers in -they weren't at all straightforward or easily understood as we did look at gathering this data to help researchers and gave up!

[thewideeyedowl]

Thank you to all for the help with this one.

This morning I contacted the Postal Heritage Museum and, after they had seen the photo, got the answer. I had mis-read 'S' for '5'. It is in fact APOS8, which translates as Dieppe. And in the circumstances that makes perfect sense because I know my grandfather was at that base in 1919 at the time of his discharge.

The museum has a copy of History of the British Army Postal Service by E B Proud (publication date not specified). Proud lists the locations of the APOs and FPOs, so if anyone else has a similar query I suggest contacting the museum and they might be able to find the answer very quickly.

They also found the very general location of APO58 - the Western Front. Obviously, this was not right for my man (and confirms what Timbo has said about APOs and FPOs being 'scrambled' to avoid easy identification). So they asked to see the photo, and back came the correction and right answer within about 15 minutes. Brilliant!

Incidentally, in my searches yesterday, I discovered a wonderful acronym: OCP, which means 'Officer Commanding Pigeons'. (Presumably he would be in the IT department these days.)

Thanks again for all the input - let's hope other folk find it useful too.

Owl

[thewideeyedowl]

History of the British Army Postal Service, Vol II, 1903-1927, Edward B Proud, Proud-Bailey Co Ltd, 1983. 312pp, hardback, illustrated with maps and photographs. The cheapest copy available in the UK is about £34 but you could pay over £200. So this is obviously one to consult via the Postal Heritage Museum if you have a simple query; or perhaps ask your library to get a copy on inter-library loan if you really need to research from it.

Edward Proud is an expert on postal history - a search on Abe Books throws up lots of titles. His work on the British Army Postal Service ran to three volumes, covering 1882 to 1965. It is obviously comprehensive; reviewers say that he is particularly good at explaining postmarks, and we now know that he lists the APOs and FPOs.

Owl

[thewideeyedowl]

Two more postal items have emerged from the piles of 'stuff' I am sorting through, very slowly. First, an envelope stamped 15 Dec 1916, so it must have been sent almost as soon as my grandfather arrived. Take a look at it and then (I hope) try to answer my questions:



1. Why was the YMCA involved in 'On Active Service' postal items?
2. Is it possible to identify Field Censor 3487?

I also have a second address on a postcard from late October 1917, which seems to be very similar to the one I uploaded at the start of this thread. The address reads:

016866
P'vt WG Ezard
89th Co AOC
WHARF
APO S8
BEF France

So this shows that my grandfather was then in 89th Company AOC. The word WHARF is included in the address, which seems to confirm a coastal location where supplies would be received. He was probably still in Dieppe? Any thoughts on this?

Owl

[simmo1]

Hi

I think that the YMCA gave soldiers stationary to write letters on, and obviously envelopes to post them in. I have seen some letters from distant relatives in WW1 written on YMCA paper.
I would think field censor lists would have been destroyed after the war (if there were any??). Usually they were censored by an officer in the battalion (I think?).

regards

Robert

[arthurk]

A bit more on the YMCA connection: during WW1 they operated hundreds of what were known as "huts" to cater for troops on their way to or from the front, or in camps nearby. These provided refreshments (non-alcoholic) and reading rooms, and often laid on concerts or lectures. Most of these were in northern France, and they were staffed by carefully chosen volunteers.

A distant relative of mine by marriage was involved in running one such hut, and after the war she was appointed MBE in recognition of her work. Even though a civilian, she also appears in some of the WW1 medal rolls because of other awards.

Arthur