MONTAGUE HENRY MOSES-CAROLINE WOOLF

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Phillip,

I am not sure where to find those records on the website. The wedding of Moses Henry Moses, son of Jacob Henry Moses and Rosetta Levy, daughter of Lawrence Levy on the 17th October 1860 at 100 Westbourne Terrace home of Mr. Levy, was presided over by Dr Adler, the Chief Rabbi. Moses Henry was 22 and Rosetta was 21.
Tony

[phillip]

Tony
On #21 you refer to the wedding of Moses Henry Moses son of Jacob Henry Moses and Rosetta Levy 17 Oct 1860. This is not the same wedding as between Moses Henry Moses and Caroline Woolf as recorded by Berger and which occurred in 1864. Are you saying that Moses Henry married twice because the Moses who married in 1864 is certainly my relative and the son of Rosa Hart.
If not, then I believe you have the wrong Moses Henry.
I hold copies of family data from the Society of Genealogists in London on the Moses/Hart lines which includes family trees for Sylvester and the others plus written correspondence in 1951 regarding Sylvester and his lines. There is further data on the lines at the Society but I was unable to copy all of it and it was several years ago that I did the research..
I would appreciate your clarification regarding the 1860 marriage.
Phillip

[phillip]

Apologies Tony for my last post - I misread Moses Henry for Montague. I will look further for Jacob Henry Moses in UK records.
Phillip

[phillip]

Tony
For clarification- if you look on World Connect Family Tree which my distant cousin Kevin Bean produced in 2007 you will see reference to 8 children of Henry Moses and Rosa Hart- Sarah,Emma, Matilda, Priscilla, Sylvester, Rhoda, Montague, Esther.
Has he missed out Moses Henry Moses? In Berger 1871-80 there is no reference in condolences on the death of Rosa to a Moses and Montague and Sylvester are named as the sons.
As I said in my earlier post-is Moses a son of Henry and Rosa because from my data and Kevin's he is not.
Phillip

[phillip]

Tony- I am still researching Moses Henry Moses b 1838 according to his age on the Marriage Certificate. Free BMD has an entry for Birth Moses Henry Moses June qtr 1838 Whitechapel 2 426. I have looked at the 1841 British Census and can see only 1 possible link to a Moses Moses of comparable age and he appears HO 107 715 3 ( Crown Copyright,TNA) - Trinity Square - Henry Moses 30 Merchant; Marianne Moses 25;Asher?11; ? 7; Floretta 6; Moses 3. There is an earlier Moses Moses b 1835 with father Joseph.
Returning to the World Connect Moses/Hart family tree and Berger records - Montague Henry Moses when he married was referred to in the Berger record as "youngest son of the late Henry Moses"- Montague was born in 1834 whereas Moses who married Rosetta was born in 1838. Unless you have other evidence it appears that Moses is not related to my Hart/Moses lines. I could get a copy of Moses birth certificate to prove this. What are your thoughts?
Phillip

[phillip]

Tony
I have seen the 1910 US Federal Census returns which include;
Sydney B MORTON 40 Tailor MW b England; Hilda Morton wife 37 b England; Montague Morton 9 son b England; Montague Hyam 45 boarder - all living Manhattan Ward New York (US Census Copyright ) T 624 12 102 0525
Also, New York Passenger List Dept Liverpool and arrive NY 7 Oct 1905 on the "Eturia"- Hilda MORTON 33 Hebrew wife of Sydney Morton 60 Morning Side Avenue NY; Montague Morton 5 same address in NY
This family I take it are Sydney Joseph ( Benjamin) Moses aka MORTON son of Montague Henry Moses and Caroline Woolf who appear with Caroline, Henry, Alfred, Evelyn, Louise, Moss, Theresa ( all MOSES); Hilda Morton 28; Montague Morton 7 mths and Sydney Morton 31 all at 125 Petheron Rd in the 1901 British Census ( I will complete full census references).
What happened to Sydney and family post 1910?
I have also seen Probate for Moses Henry Moses who died 7 Nov 1916 at 128 Westbourne Terrace Hyde Park Middx - Probate to Priscilla Moses widow and Assur Keyser; Frank Lionel Cohen and Ernest Henry Merton - Effects £30710 17s 5d. His death is Dec qtr 1916 age 78 Paddington 1a 112
The Probate for Sylvester Moses ( no name change to Morton is recorded) - Sylvester Moses 150 Houndsditch and 100 Greencroft Gardens West Hampstead died 23 May 1913 at 47 Greencroft Gardens- Probate to Henry Moses merchant;Samuel Moses barrister;Montague Moses merchant- Effects £43502 14s 7d

What can you add to this data regarding your own lines?
Phillip

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Hi Phillip,

I took a look at Kevin Beans family tree and found a number of names missing from his tree, particularly my line of the tree, which he seems to have almost nothing. My grandfather is listed as Alexander S Moses and his name was Alexander Jonas, the name was changed before his wedding from Moses to Morton. The name Henry was used as a middle name with a number of the Moses family who all had middle names. This suggests to me that any reference to a Henry Moses would be incorrect without a forename.

I suggest that you take a look at my tree on geni.com. (Anthony Davis) or search by name. It would be a good idea to get a copy of Moses Henry Moses birth certificate. His marriage certificate in 1860 states he is 22, so he would have been born in 1838.

I think that we will all find errors in each others lists of family. Unfortunately, there are not enough written records that we can rely on. Certainly the census records are full of inaccuracies regarding names and dates. I cannot comment on the Berger book as I have never seen it.

Notwithstanding all this, I am enjoying the experience of putting together a family tree with reasonable accuracy for future generations. My father spent more than twenty five years tracing his family, concentrating mainly on the Dutch side (his mother) because the Dutch kept such accurate records for hundreds of years. When he died, I inherited his hand-written work and it languished for thirty years without being touched.

I am in the middle of writing a book on Barney Barnato (Barnett Isaacs) who was one of the diamond randlords in South Africa. I discovered the Barnato tree on geni.com and that sparked my interest in looking for my family starting with my grandfather Alexander Jonas Morton. I found that there was an extensive tree already in place and so my interest was piqued. That was about two months ago. Since then I have added several thousand names and dates from my father's records. Oh, by the way, I found that I am distantly related to the subject of my book.

Since that time I have been in correspondence with distant cousins around the world.

Regards

Tony

Tony
For clarification- if you look on World Connect Family Tree which my distant cousin Kevin Bean produced in 2007 you will see reference to 8 children of Henry Moses and Rosa Hart- Sarah,Emma, Matilda, Priscilla, Sylvester, Rhoda, Montague, Esther.
Has he missed out Moses Henry Moses? In Berger 1871-80 there is no reference in condolences on the death of Rosa to a Moses and Montague and Sylvester are named as the sons.
As I said in my earlier post-is Moses a son of Henry and Rosa because from my data and Kevin's he is not.
Phillip

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Incidentally if you want email to me directly please do so at [email protected] .

Thank you for this info, Sydney Joseph and Alexander Jonas are the only two that I know of that changed their names to Morton. I remember my great aunt Hilda very well and my cousin Monty who became the London head of United Artists Pictures. He was a friend of Earl Louis Mountbatten. I have no idea of the history of Sydney as he died before I was born. Hilda and Josephine Pick (my grandmother) lived next door to Sydney and Alexander at 123 Petherton Road and the two brothers (at 125 Petherton Road), married two sisters.

Here is some detail of Alexander Jonas Morton:

Alexander Jonas Morton
Place of Burial: Section BX Row 10 # 36, Willesden Cemetery, Beaconsfield Rd, Greater London, England, United Kingdom
Birth: circa 1867
Immediate Family:

Son of Montague Henry Moses and Caroline Woolf

Husband of Josephine Morton

Father of Peggy Ruth Davis; Esme Cecilia Morton; Gerald Morton; Ernest Morton; Leslie Morton; Kenneth Morton and Celia Chase « l

Brother of Henry Moses; Celia Moses; Sydney Benjamin Morton; Alfred Moses; Leopold Joseph Moses; Eveline Floretta Moses; Louise Moses; Moss Moses and Theresa Ethel Stygall

[phillip]

Tony
I will get the Birth Certificate for Moses Henry Moses b 1838. I note that he appears on 1 Ancestry Com family tree but his parents are not Henry/Rosa Moses. I suspect he is not a son of Henry and Rosa. Doreen Berger has transcribed data from births, marriages and deaths plus messages of condolences from the Jewish Chronicle and Jewish Record - these are original messages and Doreen has linked them to various family members. She has written 2 volumes of records containing hundreds of the newspaper articles covering 1861-70; 1871-80.
I have access to Ancestry Com and other paid sites plus the British Newspaper Archives 1800-1900 and The Times so will 'dig more deeply' on the Moses/Morton lines. I have been researching my family history for many years so know where to look for data- will wait to see what else might turn up.
Phillip

[phillip]

Tony
Do you have access to Ancestry.Com and other pay sites? If not, and for others here is data on Alexander Jonas Moses aka Morton. He appears in 1881; 1901; 1911 British Census and other records- 1911 British Census RG14 6999 373 ( Crown Copyright,TNA)
" Mondesfield" Exeter Road Brondesbury NW
Alexander Jonas Morton H 44 Married 10 years Secretary Life Insurance Society b London Aldgate; Josephine wife 36 b London; Gerald Montague son 9 b Paddington;Emma Cecilia dau 7 b Paddington;Ernest Daniel son 5 b Paddington; Leslie son 1 b Willesden + 1servant nurse
Death Alexander J Morton June qtr 1918 Willesden 3a 291

Old Bailey Trial - Arthur Thomas Ellis 1910- Alexander Jonas Morton -witness Manufacturer's Agent *** Is he one in the same person as the one who appears in 1911 Census married to Josephine Pick.
Phillip