Cigar maker in mile end

[macersgirl]

Hi
I have my John Hiett (born 1851 in shoreditch) who was a cigar maker.I can not find him at all on the 1871 census but have him on the 1881 census onwards as living at Jubilee Street, mile end road Town. On the 1901 census he says he was a Journeyman -cigar maker. Am i right in thinking that Journeyman where people who had finished an Apprentiship? His grandson was my granddad and he rememberd John very well as a boy and thought he 'wasn't bad off' in money and would 'slip' him some money everytime he visited ect.

I have no idea how to go about finding out if John would have had an Apprentiship and how he would have gone about doing this and where he would have done it and how long he would have had to train? And if any records may have survived and where they would be held? I have a lovely photo of John and his familiy taken around 1900c and i would really like to put some 'meat' on him and his life.

Hope someone might beable to help me

[georgiep]

Hi Macersgirl
Have you the family in 1891?
129 Jubilee St
Mile End
John's mother Catherine is listed 73 wid living on owns means.
You probably already have this info?

Cheers
Georgie

[Geoffers]

Am i right in thinking that Journeyman where people who had finished an Apprentiship?

He is likely to have completed an apprenticeship - but cesnsus can be misleading in this respect.

I have no idea how to go about finding out if John would have had an Apprentiship......And if any records may have survived and where they would be held?

Training would be locally, and lasted from about 3-7 years. Records of apprenticeship were private contracts and very often have not survived.

[Browneyes]

Have you seen this?

https://www.genpals.co.uk/Cigars.php

[Peter Goodey]

Have you seen this?

https://www.genpals.co.uk/Cigars.php

What? Not rolled between a maiden's thighs? This is sad news indeed.

[Browneyes]

Not enough room in the factory I reckon.

[Spangle]

As far as I understand it, having Jewish ancestors from the Mile End Road area, cigar making was very much (although of course not exclusively) an Ashkenazim Jewish occupation. Perhaps your ancestor worked for a Jew if he was not one himself? It might be worth taking a look at the Jewish East End and Jewish Genealogical Society of Great Britain websites.

A quick search of the web revealed this:

Introduction to the Tobacco trade.
The Dutch Jews from Amsterdam monopolised the Cigar Making Trades and Tobacco industry in Whitechapel and St George's, they were a close-knit community. In 1860 the two districts contained 2294 Dutch Jews and only 894 Polish Jews. In 1875 it was estimated that between 3000 and 4000 industrious Jewish workers were engaged in the metropolis in the tailoring and tobacco trades. Most Jewish manufacturers were employing fifty or more workers in the tobacco business, because the Excise authorities forbade transfers of small quantities of leaf and the amount of machinery required meant that considerable capital was needed (at least £50 to £100). Of the 1900 Cigar-makers in London late in the 1880s, 800 were men and 1100 were women, 251 of the men and 113 of the women were "Russians and Poles". Wages were good and work was regular. Cigar-makers earned on piecework up to 40/- (£2.00) a week, tobacco-cutters by hand £2 to £3. As late as 1901 there were still 343 men and 48 women of Dutch descent carrying on the Cigar-making trade. However the onset of machine made Cigars and cigarettes in the 1900s led to the end of an era of the handmade product. The families of Sasieni, cover five generations of Pipe Makers and Tobacco Manufacturer, originating from Amsterdam, Holland to London, England and the Sasieni name is still used today in the production of pipes, tobacco and smokers products in the USA.

https://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache...&ct=clnk&gl=uk