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  1. #1
    Loves to help with queries
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    Default McCulloch - Edinburgh

    Hello

    Helpful suggestions welcomed so I can start on my Scottish ancestry.

    Problem I have is my grandmother, I never knew her so that doesn't help.
    Her name was Jean McCulloch, now I have a recollection of my Mother referring to her as Jean Wilson McCulloch but I'm not certain. Her marriage record for 1925 makes no mention of the Wilson bit. From her age she was born abt 1900, her parents John McCulloch and Jean ? are dead. To make matters more confusing my Father as the informant on my Grandmothers death lists her Father as Thomas McCulloch and no first name for his wife but Mc Nairn as her maiden name.

    Help!! What else can I do to get further on, or is this it?

  2. #2
    JustJean
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    Far too soon to think you have a brick wall now! If you examine the Marriage Certificate (MC), and yes the handwriting is a bit of a challenge but not the worst I've seen, note that details that you can glean......

    Father's name: John McCulloch
    Father's occupation: Farmer
    Deceased at time of marriage in 1925
    Mother's name: Jane or Jean McCulloch
    Mother's maiden surname: Looks like McNairn to me!
    Deceased at time of marriage in 1925
    Age of bride: 25 years

    These details should have more reliability than her DC since it was your grandmother herself who supplied them.

    Ok so now like you pointed out she seems to have been born about 1900.

    First a search on SP aka scotlandspeople.gov.uk for a marriage of her parents. Since there was some later controversary with her father's first name (John or THomas) I opted to search only on male surname and female surname to start...MCCULLOCH and MCNAIRN just like that. There were only two results in the year spread from 1855-1925! So I took a chance and viewed them and the first one looks very very promising as it's right names and right time frame....

    1900 MCCULLOCH JOHN MCNAIRN JEANIE ST GEORGE EDINBURGH CITY/MIDLOTHIAN 685/01 0547

    Now a peek at this document brings some very interesting facts to light. John was a 48 year old widower and his usual address was in Glasserton!! A quick run over to the 1901 census and voila..

    Registration Number: 885
    Registration district: Glasserton
    Civil Parish: Glasserton
    County: Wigtownshire
    Address: Rouchan Farmhouse

    Household consists of:

    John McCulloch age 58 (interesting how fast he is aging!), head, occ: Farmer, b. Glasserton
    Jeannie N McCulloch age 32, wife
    John G M McCulloch age 11, son
    Janet McCulloch age 10, dau
    Grace Malone age 16, domestic
    John Irven age 14, farm servant

    Odd that there is no baby Jean with them but perhaps she has not been born yet. A search for a female McCulloch born in Glasserton in the span of 1901-1905 turns up just one....but she is registered as a Margaret!!!! Not only that but her parents seem to think she is illegitmate even though we have their marriage recorded in Edinburgh some months earlier.

    1901 MCCULLOCH MARGARET F GLASSERTON /WIGTOWN 885/00 0014

    So no choice now but to see if Jeannie and John died before 1925. Sadly (but hopefully adding proof that we have the right couple) that answer is yes...

    1902 MCCULLOCH JEANIE MCNAIRN F 32 GLASSERTON /WIGTOWN 885/00 0010
    1904 MCCULLOCH JOHN M 65 GLASSERTON /WIGTOWN 885/00 0005

    But a look at the DC for Jeanie shows cause of death was Puerperal fever 3 days and date of death was 16 Nov 1902. Oddly enough here she is listed as Single and the informant is a brother in law named John McCulloch!!! Well there is only one cause of puerperal fever....and that is childbirth. Meaning that Jeanie had given birth about mid Nov. But where is the baby??? There is no corresponding BC or DC to account for the child. At first I wondered if this birth might be your Jean but after some further sleuthing below....well now I’m wondering if perhaps she had suffered a miscarriage or perhaps everyone was so distraught that the child was just never recorded.

    Now here comes the real puzzle piece from out of left field!! On the 1901 census in Glasserton there is a wee Jeanie McNairn 1 year old rooming with a family.

    Registration Number: 885
    Registration district: Glasserton
    Civil Parish: Glasserton
    County: Wigtownshire
    Address: Beggarkow Glasserton

    Household consists of:
    Peter McAlister, head, age 73
    Jane McAlister, wife, age 50
    James McAlister, son, age 21
    Jeanie McNairn age 1, boarder, b. Glasserton

    A search for wee Jeanie’s BC in Glasserton comes right up…

    1899 MCNAIRN JEANIE HATHORN F GLASSERTON /WIGTOWN 885/00 0027

    And from a peek at that there is no doubt in my mind that she was the daughter of Jeanie McNairn housekeeper at Rouchan farm, Glasserton. Since she is registered illegitimate and no mention is made of John McCulloch I wonder at her paternity! Especially since she was not resident in the home of John and Jeanie. She was however born at Rouchan farm!

    Some further investigating shows that John McCulloch’s first wife was named Mary McNairn….and since her parent’s names match those of Jeanie McNairn's it’s looking quite obvious they were sisters. As in John McCulloch married his sister-in-law and had at least one child with her after his wife’s death. This was perfectly legal under Scots Law as far as I know. In fact if wee Jeanie Hathorn McNairn was his daughter too then her birth would have been legitimated when they married in 1900 Edinburgh as long as they were both unmarried at the time of her conception.

    I think Jeanie born in 1899 has a good chance of being your grandmother. What do you think?

    Best wishes
    Jean

  3. #3
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    Wow Jean, you are a star, I've spent 12 months drawing blanks at every corner. I need to read this properly tomorrow (been out for a meal!) but you know what, prior to my Mum's death, I told her I would be researching my Family tree and with that MOTHER'S LOOK (raised eyebrow) she told me,
    "you might not like what you find".

    Of course, it doesn't bother me, I just want to know where I come from. I am an only child of parents who were only children, I know somewhere out there I have living relations.

    Thanks for your help, much appreciated.

    Alison

  4. #4
    JustJean
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    Hi Alison

    Well I'm relieved that you aren't throwing sharp objects in my direction!! I'm not sure I've come up with definitive proof yet either...but sometimes I just get a feeling for these things and with yours I have that feeling. I had a bit of a look but not exhaustive yet for a marriage of one of the older kids in the 1901 household...Janet or John but so far am drawing blanks. John was the informant on his father's death. I was trying to figure out how your grandmother might have ended up living in Edinburgh...like if she might have gone there to be raised or something. There has got to be some sort of clue that can help you link positively to this 1899 birth of Jeanie McNairn. Of course the 1911 census might be a real boost but you'll have to wait a few years yet for the Scottish one to be open. I also didn't immediately see what might have happened with baby Margaret McCulloch or try to find Jeanie McNairn with her parents to see if she might have had more than just the one sister Mary....so you have some work yet to do on this.

    Best wishes
    Jean

    PS....know all about those mother's raised eyebrow looks

  5. #5
    check81
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    Default Janet Nairn McCulloch

    After a discussion with Jack Gilmour about how and when his mother had come to Canada, in which he said there was some doubt about which of his grandfather’s three wives was his grandmother, I did some digging around on the web. I came across this thread, and have added a bit of research that might be interesting.

    The McCulloch family was an ancient, famous, and powerful family with Norse origins, whose home was in Galloway, and had major land holdings down through the years. One of the attachments is a history of the land and landowners of Galloway, and the book it references (free on the web) is a very interesting read.
    Janet Nairn McCulloch was born 25 March, 1891 at Rouchan Farm, Glasserton Parish, Wigtown, Scotland. Her parents were John McCulloch and Mary McNairn. Janet was with her family in the census of 1901, still living at Rouchan. Both of her parents died shortly after that census. In the 1911 census, there are two Janet McCullochs aged 20 in all of Scotland . One of these is Janet N McCulloch living in Edinburgh. She was a tenant in a rooming house in Gilmore Place in Morningside. She emigrated sometime after 1911 to Canada to work in Montreal, and eventually moved to Saskatoon and married James Gilmour.
    Now to her family!
    Janet’s father John was born around 1838. I could not find his birth record. (before 1855, all records were done by the Parish, and it is not unusual for ones to be missing, or in another parish, etc). There is some doubt about the 1838 date, since his age varies by about 8 years in the various documents I viewed. But 1838 jives with a date of death of 1904 (for which we have the record) at an age of 65 years old. His father was Robert McCulloch and his mother was Margaret Nelson.
    John’s first marriage was to a widow, 9 years his elder, named Isabella Wallace. Her first husband’s name is Anderson. I did not find the marriage record, but in 1881 they were living at a farm called Cairndoon Bank Farm. You will find reference to it from centuries ago in the history of Galloway. The people living with them are Isabella Muir (a visiting daughter, obviously married to a Muir), Mary McCreadie, a domestic servant and Alexander McCubbin (aged 16, a farm helper). The family two farms away is named Anderson….maybe her former in-laws?
    Isabella died in 1887 of pneumonia. She was 58. I did not check to see if any other children were born between 1881 (no children shown in that census) and 1887; it seemed unlikely given her age. She died at Rouchan, so they moved there sometime between 1881 and 1887.

    On February 14, 1889, John married Mary McNairn at Penninghame Parish, in Wigtown. Mary’s father was Samuel, and his mother was Janet McKie, and they were from Meikle Eldrig in the Parish of Penninghame. Her age was 27 on the marriage record. His was shown as 41, but that was impossible. He was actually 51. He continues this deception as we move on!! They had only five years together. Their first child was John Gordon McCulloch, born in November 1889. The second was Janet Nairn McCulloch, born in 1891. And the third was Mary McNairn McCulloch, born in 1893. This child died in her first year.
    John’s second wife, Mary, died at the age of 33 on 12 April 1894, of pneumonia, at Rouchan. (bad place for pneumonia, Rouchan.) At the time of her death, her children were aged five, three and one.
    John married a third time, this time to Mary’s sister, Jean or Jeannie or Jane McNairn. They were married in a civil marriage in the district of St George in Edinburgh on 24 Oct 1900. John’s age is shown as 58, but he dies five years later at the age of 65. Jeannie was 30 when they married. In the 1901 census, they are living at Rouchan. The family is John, Jeannie, son John G (aged 11), daughter Janet Nairn (aged 10), a domestic servant named Grace Malone aged 16, and a farmhand named John Irvens, aged 14.
    After their marriage, they had two children. (John was 61 years old, by my count, when they were married. Kind of late for starting a family.) Margaret was born 16 May 1901, and James was born 16 November 1902 . They were both registered as illegitimate, although they are registered with their father’s name. This illegitimacy is interesting….it was apparently not legal to marry your wife’s sister even if your wife was dead, until 1907. I think they got caught between Church and State….it was ok for the state to have a civil marriage, but the Church was not going to accept that.
    There is an amazing wrinkle here. There was another baby to Jeannie McNairn, born in 1899, before the civil marriage. The baby was baptised as Jeannie McNairn, and recorded publicly as illegitimate. (See the birth record). The baby was born at Rouchan. The baby is not shown with Jean and John McCulloch in the 1901 census, but there is an infant Jeannie Hathorn McNairn living in the same parish with an older family and their son. Here is the record from the census:
    Civil Parish: Glasserton
    County: Wigtownshire
    Address: Beggarkow Glasserton

    Household consists of:
    Peter McAlister, head, age 73
    Jane McAlister, wife, age 50
    James McAlister, son, age 21
    Jeanie McNairn age 1, boarder, b. Glasserton
    So why was the little Jeannie farmed out to another family just before Jeannie and John were married? Especially to the McAlister family who were pretty old to be looking after an infant? Maybe the father of Jeannie Hathorn McNairn was the McAlister boy, and not John McCullough? BTW Hathorn is an ancient and noble Galloway name. Was Jane McAlister, the foster mother, a Hathorn by birth?

    Jean McCulloch died in childbirth on 16 November 1902, at the time of the birth of her son James, at Rouchan. In her death record, she is shown as single, and the death is witnessed by John McCulloch, her brother-in-law (to whom she was married). That is really sad---somehow the civil marriage was not good enough for the Scottish church. John McCulloch died at Rouchan in 1904 of a stroke, but after a long illness. We don’t know what happened after the death of Jeannie in 1902. At that time,James Mc McCulloch was 63, and the children were:
    John Gordon McCulloch, aged 13
    Janet Nairn McCulloch, aged 11
    Jeannie McNairn, aged 4, living with the McAlisters
    Margaret McCulloch, aged 3
    James McCulloch, newborn

    So there are still lots of questions? Where did Janet Nairn McCulloch grow up after the death of her second mother when she was just 11? Did she become the caregiver for her little brother and sister? When did she go to Edinburgh: we know she was there in the 1911 census. We know she emigrated to Canada, married James Gilmour, had two children….are there still relatives in Scotland who are descended from her sisters and brothers? We know that there is at least one....AMG2512 has a bunch of second cousins in Canada!

  6. #6
    Loves to help with queries
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    Hello Check81

    How exciting, second cousins in Canada! I can reply only briefly since I have sneaked onto a friends computer & don't have all my details to hand.

    Your post above definately confirms the information I have, with of course some extra information on Janet Nairn McCulloch who I know I lost track of in 1921 with her arrival in New Brunswick.

    When I return home, I will hopefully be able to reply with some more detail.

    Alison

  7. #7
    Loves to help with queries
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    Hello Check81

    I'm loving this, 2 threads that I can hopefully provide some help with, although on this one I think you know as much as I.

    John McCulloch was born 10th May 1839 & christened on the 25th May at Glasserton, Wigtownshire. His parents as you know were Robert McCulloch & Margaret Nelson/Nielson. I have found only 3 other siblings to John who was the eldest, Robert, Mary & Susan, none of whom I have had much luck in tracing.

    Do you have access to Ancestry? my tree is there but private (people keep stealing my relations & giving them the wrong parents etc.)

    It has been a while since I've looked back at this part of the Family & I have now confused myself as I seem to have not added Margaret as one of John & Jean's children!

    I can add no further information on Janet Nairn McCulloch, you obviously know more than I. I have often wondered if she was the one left to look after the children after Jean's death, we know from John's death 2 years later that he had been suffering from cardio vascular disease for 7 years. Janet Nairn McCulloch in 1901 living in Edinburgh was a typist for a legal firm. Do you have any information on her brother, John Gordon McCulloch? I cannot trace him beyond 1904 when he registers his Father's death.

    I have added James & Jack Gilmour to my tree & see that Jack would be my 1st Cousin once removed due to our sharing the same Great/Grandfather.

    I am descended from Jean Hathorn McCulloch (where the Hathorn comes from, I don't know) the poor baby farmed out in the 1901 census. Did she ever return home, by 1911 Jean is staying with her maternal Grandmother's sister Mary Shearer nee Mckie. Mary & her daughter, also Mary, continued caring for Jean up until 1917 when Mary senior died in Sorbie, Wigtownshire. Mary junior obviously played a big part in Jean's life for it is my Father that registers her death in 1947 in Dunfermline.

    I'm off to have a look at tree again & see if I can provide any more detail. I do hope you have some new information for me.

    Many thanks
    Alison

  8. #8
    check81
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    Hi amg2512
    Sorry this has taken a while....Outlook put the e-mail notice in the Spam folder. In the 1911 census of Canada, John Gordon McCulloch is staying with his uncle Andrew T McNairn and family. Census is Toronto Centre, subdistrict 39 Ward 4, page 4 and 5. (https://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca...e002024500.pdf). It says he went to Canada in 1910. Also living with them is Andrew Anderson, born 1879. You will recall that John McCullochs first wife was Isabella Wallace whose maiden name was Anderson. He was not with the McCulloch family in the 1881 census, but may have stayed close to the McCullochs/McNairns.
    In the 1881 census for the Samuel McNairn family at Penninghame, there are two Shearer children staying with the family. Looks like the Shearer's got to return the favour with your grandmother!
    I dont have a personal Ancestry account. I will look on the library version and see if I can see your tree.
    This is great, we have filled in a lot of blank spaces!

  9. #9
    Loves to help with queries
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    Hello again

    Thank you for the information on John Gordon McCulloch, I am so pleased to know that he travelled to Canada with Andrew Thomas McNairn & Family, Andrew of course being another uncle. Unfortunately I cannot read the census information it's just too faint, & although I have full membership, Canadian records seem to be thin on the ground. I must admit I think the Family were brave to emigrate at this time since Agnes, Andrew's wife appears to be 5 months pregnant giving birth to Samuel Alexander McNairn in October of that year, Perhaps when they made their plans they just didn't know!

    The 1881 census for Samuel McNairn, yes the 2 Shearer children are Samuel & Janet's Grandchildren, their Daughter Mary married Andrew Shearer & it is this Mary Shearer who looked after my Grandmother, so my above post where I said Jean was looked after by her Grandmother's sister is incorrect, she was infact looked after by an Aunt... so confusing..

    If you do get a chance to look on Ancestry, you will have to send a request to me requesting access to my tree, it's all very quick but with our time differences it will take longer.

    Yes it's lovely to fill in the blank spaces, I have set aside some time today to look at Canadian records on Ancestry, guess what, sites down for routine maintenence!!

    Alison
    Last edited by amg2512; 18-10-2012 at 8:39 AM. Reason: needs to check spelling before hitting send

  10. #10
    Newcomer to Brit-Gen
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    Smile Janet Nairn McCulloch from Glasserton

    Janet Nairn McCulloch was my grandmother. I have very little information on her family history.

    So glad to see all this information.

    Janet arrived in Canada (in the early 1900's) and gave birth to twin boys. (My father and uncle). I have 2 brothers and my Uncle also had 5 children.

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