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  1. #1
    roysloan
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    Default Samuel Heath, Newington Parish, London

    Need assistance in obtaining information on a Samuel Heath who is my GGG grandfather. I believe died before the 1941 Census as there is no record of him in 1841 or beyond. His son Albion was on his own in Wales in the 1841 census but I have a few solid clues to his past.
    1. I believe I have located his brother who was Emanuel Heath (a carpenter). Born 1799 in Shepton Mallet, Somerset England. Emanuel Heath & family lived in Newington Butts around 1828 to at least 1851.
    2. Samuel Heath is shown as a "Grocer" on his son Albion's marriage certificate in 1841. I understand that 1/3 of Newington was occupied by Market Gardneners which fits for a "Grocer"
    3. There is a marriage listed on the IGI at St. Mary's Newington, London for Samuel Heath & Ruth Hazell on 04 Jan 1818 which could be a match as his son Albion Heath was born May 14, 1819. Can anyone look this up to see if he was a Grocer?
    Unfortuately there is no IGI birth record for Albion. Albion became a carpenter and would have apprenticed in London.

    Additional Questions?
    1. I am getting conflicting information on baptism registers for Saint Marys Newington. I read that they are available from 1813 on but I have not located yet. This may be why I cannot find Albion on the IGI. Does anyone know what is actually available? Did all of St mary's parish registers survive?
    2. After 1754 you were required to be married in an Anglican Church but if they were non conformist could you be baptisted in a non conformist church? If so what Non conformist churches were in Newington and are there registers

    Any help would be appreciated in finding any additional infomation on this Heath family.

  2. #2
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    Hi, and welcome to the forum

    Sorry if I've missed a trick, but can you say why you think Samuel HEATH lived in Newington, and how you know that Albion HEATH was born there? Do you have Albion in any census after 1841? As you have his date of birth but no baptism, presumably your information is from another source.

    To try to answer some of your other questions, St Mary Newington parish registers are complete, as far as I'm aware. Baptisms have been extracted to the IGI 1813-1837 (batches C055631 and C055632). The marriage register (in common with most marriage registers at this date) does not state occupations before 1837, except in very rare cases.

    All the original registers for this parish are held at the London Metropolitan Archives. LDS films for dates after 1813 can be hired into Family History Centres -- run a Place Search on Newington, (part of) Surrey, in their online catalogue for details of coverage.

    Even though Albion was born in Newington he may have been baptised elsewhere, or indeed not at all. If you want to post more of what you know about him and his family, someone might be able to help further.

    Kerrywood

  3. #3
    roysloan
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    Kerrywood, Thanks for the welcome and the reply. To answer your question that may help to assist you and others, I have always known that Albion Heath was from London from my Great Grandmother and that he immigrated to Canada after 1841. He was married in Toronto Canada as a widower in 1846. How I finally arrived at Newington, London is a long story.
    Frederick T. Heath (a non family member age 20) died in 1883 and was buried in Chatham, Ontario Canada in a plot owned by Albion S. Heath with a grave trancription that stated that he originated from London, England. I was thinking that this was a nephew as Albion had a son named Frederick that was the same age. I traced Frederick T. Heath back to London and came to find out that he was not a nephew but most likely the son of Samuel Heath's brother Emanuel who was also a carpenter like Albion. Again this is still has to be proven but as I believe, Samuel Heath & Emanuel Heath were brothers and again the assumption is that Emanuel took him into the carpentry trade when his father Samuel died. On the 1841 and the 1851 census one of Emanuel's sons and two daughters were born at Saint Olave Silver St. which is Newington, Surrey. One of Emanuels daughters Emma was baptised 11 SEP 1831 at St Mary Madgelen, Old Fish Street, London, and a son Emanuel was baptised 18 Jan. 1835 at Saint Mary Somerset, Upper Thames Street, London and both parishes are right across the river from Newington Surrey. Now to answer your question why Newington. When I found a Samuel Heath marriage at St. Mary Newington in 1818 and the other part of the family is living at or near I am thinking Newington. Once I see or if anyone has information on Samuel Heath marriage to Ruth Hazell on 04 Jan 1818 at St Marys Newington that may help.
    It is still a guess but if a marriage register does not give any reference to occupation or name of Samuels father that I can go back to Shepton Mallet, Somerset England with, I will be stuck again. It is unfortunate that I couldn't find Albion S. Heath's birth or baptism (May 1819) in the IGI. It has taken me years to get to this point but out of Emanuel Heath's five children I could find only three in the IGI and they in are in three different parishes from Hoxton, Hackney, (1925) to St. Mary Madgelen Old Fish Street (1931) to Saint Mary Somerset, Upper Thames (1835) which again is right across from Newington, Surrey.

    Again, if anyone has any suggestions or information it would be appreciated.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by roysloan View Post
    Frederick T. Heath (a non family member age 20) died in 1883 and was buried in Chatham, Ontario Canada in a plot owned by Albion S. Heath with a grave trancription that stated that he originated from London, England. I was thinking that this was a nephew as Albion had a son named Frederick that was the same age. I traced Frederick T. Heath back to London and came to find out that he was not a nephew but most likely the son of Samuel Heath's brother Emanuel who was also a carpenter like Albion. Again this is still has to be proven but as I believe, Samuel Heath & Emanuel Heath were brothers and again the assumption is that Emanuel took him into the carpentry trade when his father Samuel died.
    I think I see where you're coming from, but there are a lot of beliefs and assumptions here. Your whole premise seems to be based on your findings in Chatham ON for one Frederick T. HEATH, but you say he is a non-family member. Is that correct? HEATH is an extremely common surname. I wonder how you can be sure that you have identified the right man in London?

    Quote Originally Posted by roysloan View Post
    On the 1841 and the 1851 census one of Emanuel's sons and two daughters were born at Saint Olave Silver St. which is Newington, Surrey.
    I'm afraid you have confused two St Olaves in London. St Olave Silver Street (where Emanuel HEATH is found in 1851 and 1841) is in the City of London, close to St Mary Magdalen Old Fish St and St Mary Somerset, as you say. It is not in Newington Surrey. The St Olave parish which is close to Newington Surrey is St Olave Southwark, a totally different parish on the other side of the river. Though separated by the river these two St Olaves are not far apart in mileage, but I'm afraid I can't see any real Newington connection for this family.

    Just to establish some facts for others to follow, in 1851 and 1841 Emanuel HEATH the Carpenter (born c1799 Shepton Mallet) is living in Monkwell Street, in the parish of St Olave Silver Street, City of London.

    1851
    HO107-1529 folio 212 page 8
    5 Monkwell Street, St Olave Silver Street, London
    Emanuel Barley? Heath Head Marr 52 Carpenter Somerset Shepton Mallet
    Rhoda Heath Wife 49 Straw Bonnet Maker Beds Melchbourne
    Emma Heath Daur U 19 Cotton Ball Winder City of London St Olave
    Mary Heath Daur 11 Scholar City of London St Olave
    Charles Heath Son 10 Scholar City of London St Olave

    1841
    HO107-723-3 folio 8 page 10
    Monkwell St, St Olave Silver Street, London
    Emanuel Heath 42 Carpenter N [= not born in county of Middlesex]
    Rhoda Heath 37 N
    Frederick Heath 16 Y [= born in county of Middlesex]
    Emma Heath 10 Y
    Mary Heath 2 Y

    Frederick was apparently baptised twice (1825 Academy Chapel, Hoxton; 1831 St Mary Magdalen Old Fish Street).

    Emanuel HEATH's birth (23 Jan 1799) and baptism (8 Feb 1799) at Shepton Mallet are transcribed at FreeReg. He is said to be the son of Samuel HEATH and Elizabeth. There are likely siblings there too, but no baptism for a son Samuel to this couple is listed at Shepton Mallet. Yet you think Samuel and Emanuel are brothers? So have you found a baptism for Samuel in a nearby parish?

    How do you think the Frederick T. HEATH found in Canada and apparently born c1863 in Canada would be related to this Frederick born 1825, son of Emanuel?

    I have to go out now for the rest of day, but no doubt someone else will advise you further before I get back.

    Kerrywood
    Last edited by Kerrywood; 20-01-2009 at 12:37 PM. Reason: added a bit

  5. #5
    roysloan
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    Default Follow up to Samuel Heath-New Information

    Kerrywood:
    Thanks for taking the time on this and for clearing up the two St. Olaves, this really make sense now. Yes, Newington is out of the picture.

    New Information: I found a Samuel Heath born 19 Sept 1818 C. 16 Aug 1818 at St. Luke Old St. Finsbury, London Father: Samuel Heath & Mary ???

    Also a Frederick Heath b. 19 July 1822 C. 12 Aug 1822 at St. Leonards, Shoreditch. (Note: Close by is Academy Chapel in Hoxbury) Father Samuel Heath & Mary Ann

    These are births before and after May 1919 when Albion Heath was born so they could be siblings to Albion.

    Emanuel first son Frederick was born in Hoxton and as you said baptised twice
    (1825 Academy Chapel, Hoxton; 1831 St Mary Magdalen Old Fish Street).

    I also found a marriage of a Samuel Heath and Mary Tucker 25 Dec 1810 at St. Anne Soho Westmisinister but that date seems a little far back. Once we have a birth date for Samuel, maybe it will be a possible match.

    To answer your question as far as the relation in Canada of Frederick T. Heath b. 1863 in Islington (which was Finsbury) he was Charles Heath's son (He is the last born to Charles in 1851 census) So the Frederick Heath born to Emanuel would be Frederick T. Heath's Uncle.

    It looks as if this is slowly coming together. As we now we also have a possibility of Frederick Heath born to Samuel Heath at St. Luke Old st. , Finsbury

    Thanks you for finding the baptism Samuel Heath in Shepton Malett. With his father name being Samuel it seems like we are getting close. I will keep looking for Samuel but he must have been born ior baptisted in another parish. Now that you have provided a fathers and mothers name for Emanuel, I hopefully will have success in figuring this out.

    Thanks again for your assitance!

    Roy

  6. #6
    roysloan
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    Default Samuel Heath-Family Information Update

    Kerrywood:
    Using FreeReg I was able to put together all the siblings for Samuel & Elizabeth Heath in Shepton Mallett. They did have a son named Samuel but his birth date of of February 14, 1810 will not work as Albions father as Albion birth is May 14, 1819.

    Here is the family in Shepton Mallet, Somerset as the parish registers indicate.

    Husband: Samuel Heath b. Abt. 1773 Shepton Mallet
    Wife: Elizabeth Barley
    Married: 8 May 1796 Shepton Mallet
    1. John Heath b. 21 Jan 1797
    2. Emanuel Barley Heath b. 23 Jan 1799
    3. Frederick Heath b. 5 May 1802
    4. Paul Barley Heath b. 16 April 1804
    5. Martha Barley Heath b. 22 Dec 1805
    6. Hannah Heath b. 7 Dec 1807
    7. Samuel Heath 14 Feb 1810
    8. Thomas Pyke Heath b. 26 Jan 1812

    Note: For what is worth Albion's first son was named John and he had daughter named Hannah and his youngest son was also a Frederick.

    With the father Samuel Heath b. 1773 he would have been 46 years old in 1819.
    I am now thinking that Emanuel & Albion could be brothers. Of course without Albion's baptism record this will be hard to prove. His father was not around for the 1941 Census. If he was alive he would have been 68 years of age when Albion was married in Wales. If I could only prove that Samuel Heath b. 1773 was a "Grocer" by trade then I would be on the right track. I have no idea where to go from here. Any thoughts or ideas on where to search next?

    Roy

  7. #7
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    1841 census
    HO107-963-12 folio 28 page 9
    Kilverstreet, Shepton Mallet, Somerset
    Samuel HEATH 67 Shop Keeper Yes
    Elizabeth HEATH 66 Yes
    Samuel HEATH 30 Yes

    There are possible deaths for Samuel and Elizabeth in Shepton Mallet registration district in 1845 and 1851 respectively. This family seems to be a fixture in Shepton Mallet. It's unlikely they had a son (Albion) in London in 1819 and subsequently moved back. Elizabeth would have been at the very end of her child-bearing years in 1819.

    If you do want to pursue them further, an early directory for Shepton might clarify what sort of shop Samuel had. You could try Historical Directories, or contact the Somerset Record Office.

    Instead, I'd suggest that your priority should be to find a baptism for Albion and pin him to the right Samuel. Perhaps you could tackle this from another angle and try to establish how and when Albion moved to Canada. Was he in the army, perhaps? Just a thought.

    Sorry I can't help more
    Kerrywood

  8. #8
    Brick wall demolition expert!
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    I see on this pay website that there is a baptism for Albin Heath in 1820 in Worcestershire RG4 1907.

    bmdregisters.co.uk

    Upon payment, you will be able to download the actual image of the register.

    Adele
    Last edited by ChristineR; 25-01-2009 at 3:02 AM. Reason: remove commercial link

  9. #9
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    It's on the IGI. This Albin's father is Edward. Roy is looking for a father Samuel

    Kerrywood

  10. #10
    Brick wall demolition expert!
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    Thanks, I should have checked the IGI.

    Quote Originally Posted by roysloan View Post
    Albions father as Albion birth is May 14, 1819.
    Roy,
    How do you know that this is the date of Albions' birth?
    Adele

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