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  1. #1
    bobn
    Guest

    Default Samuel Nathan Re-Visited

    I joined this site after seeing a posting by LADKYIS dated Oct 2006 re SAMUEL NATHAN having died due to blows on the head. My 2x great grandfather ABRAHAM NATHAN's marriage certificate Jan 1843 states father as Samuel Nathan occupation picture dealer. I would like to know if this is the same Samuel who married HANNAH MENDES in 1808. So far I have been unable to get this link and any confirmation would be great.

  2. #2

    Default yes more info later

    I have seen this post, I have information, I am just back in the house after 2 days in the Wales Craft Council pavilion at the Winter Fair at the Royal Welsh Show ground. My eyes are scratchy and I am so tired my brain does not really function. But I will be back tomorrow, as soon as real life gets out of the way a bit.

    Lots of info on Samuel and Hannah - the Samuel who was "feloniously killed and slayed"
    Sadly, our dear friend Ann (alias Ladkyis) passed away on Thursday, 26th. December, 2019.
    Footprints on the sands of time

  3. #3
    bobn
    Guest

    Default

    Look forward to this. I hope you can confirm a positive link with my
    2xggrandfather and your Samuel (hopefully also my 3xggrandfather)
    Regds Bob

  4. #4

    Default

    I have now had a chance to look at my file and I do not have an Abraham as a child of Samuel and Hannah. What I have is a six year gap between Aaron (abt 1812) and Jane (abt1818).
    There is also a David mentioned in the newspaper report of Samuel's death that I haven't put into his rightful place.

    the 1841 census has this
    HO107 1084/1 F8 p7/8
    Borough Road, Southwark. (they lived at 1 Borough Road)

    Samuel Nathan 55 General Dealer N (not born in same county)
    Hannah do 50 (Something crossed out here) N
    Sarah do 20 Bunce Maker Y
    Jane do 20 do y
    John do 20 General Dealer Y
    Samuel do 15 do Y
    Nancy do 15 Dress Maker Y
    Rachael do 14 Y
    Anna do 10 Y
    Fanny do 8 Y
    Henry do 6 Y

    Bear in mind that ages of adults were rounded down but even so she was pretty old to have had Henry.

    I will enquire within the Jewish Genealogical Society about finding records of births - and briths (cos Abraham is a boy) and see if we can make this connection.
    Sadly, our dear friend Ann (alias Ladkyis) passed away on Thursday, 26th. December, 2019.
    Footprints on the sands of time

  5. #5
    bobn
    Guest

    Default

    Hi Ann
    Well I worked from 1851 census that Sarah was born circa 1817; John was born 1819 from 1881 census; Samuel circa 1824 accounting for rounding up or down on the 1841 census; therefore there was a gap between these dates for Jane and possibly one other?
    Abraham was born 1820/21 by my findings which would allow a time slot between these children. Abraham was born St Georges Southwark and from his marriage certificate in April 1843 it states father as Samuel a picture dealer. I understand that the word "deceased" was sometimes omitted on certificates.
    I searched all the churches around Lambeth/Southwark/Bermondsey (about 20 in all)for his birth records at the London Metro Records office giving a few years either side and could find nothing. I took this to be either he has Jewish parents or non conformists. I also noted that most of the Nathans came from the East End from the census around that time.
    Lets hope you can find something in your search.
    Bob

  6. #6
    bobn
    Guest

    Default

    There is another possible link which may show in other documents. Abraham married Mary Holt whose father was Thomas Holt a painter. Is it possible that he and Samuel were associates and possibly a witness for the prosecution??

  7. #7

    Default

    So have we found Abraham in the 1841 Census? He's not at home with Hannah and Samuel at 1 Borough Road. Is he in lodgings somewhere, perhaps.
    I just looked at my notes and I don't have Aaron and his wife Jane in the 1841 either
    Sadly, our dear friend Ann (alias Ladkyis) passed away on Thursday, 26th. December, 2019.
    Footprints on the sands of time

  8. #8
    bobn
    Guest

    Default

    Hi Ann
    yes maybe; I found an Abraham born abt 1821 in Surrey; the registration district was in the parish of Merton with street address of Double Toll Gate. If this was him he was living with 2 other males all posted as no occupation. The 1841 census is patchy as you know and the information not as good as the latter census years. I found him again in the 1851 census, born St Georges Surrey and living in Southwark.
    Bobn

  9. #9

    Default

    Well that's good! Now I am wondering if there was a row with his family and he left home and... I must try and curtail these flights of fantasy.

    My puter can't see the scanner. I can see it, right there next to me on the desk but the puter can't see it, not this week. I have unplugged it from the USB port it WAS in and tomorrow before I start the puter up again I will plug it into a different port and see if the puter can see it then. Only than will I know if I can scan the pages I have or if I have to try and photograph what is already a photograph of the pages of a book of trial records - sigh - I wonder if anyone is going to LMA and could look at the original records for me.
    Sadly, our dear friend Ann (alias Ladkyis) passed away on Thursday, 26th. December, 2019.
    Footprints on the sands of time

  10. #10
    bobn
    Guest

    Default

    - sigh - I wonder if anyone is going to LMA and could look at the original records for me.[/QUOTE]

    For all concerned, the LMA is closed for refurbish until end of Feb 2008 so I was told.

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