Help finding John Burum

[pat fowles]

Hi All.. I have been looking for info for John Burum for years (surname is elusive). Today up popped his Attestation record. He was born 14 March 1901, according to the papers, in St Helens, Lancashire. On Fam search is a Non Conformist baptism record ...Joannes Buram b14th March 1901, Baptised 17 March 1901 Lancashire. Parents Augustini Burum & Barbarae Kourpakite Buram. Have searched GRO for his birth, can't find it using lots of variations on surname. Can't find him on 1911 census. Have looked for his parents...nothing. I have his marriage/death details. Can anyone find a GRO record for him. Any suggestions for his parents records would be welcome. Thank you

[Jomot1]

On the military record it says his PoB is Widnes, St Helens, Lancashire, and with a DoB of 14 Mar 1901 he should appear on both the 1901 census as 2-weeks old, so how about these two:

1911 - 23 Burton Street, Collyhurst, Manchester

Barbora Burmani 50 Widow, Rag Sorter born Russia Poland
Josph Burmani (or Bowman) 21 son Single, Coal Miner born Russia Poland
Barbora Burmani 25 daur Married b Russia Poland
Margaret Burmani (or Bowmani) 16 daur Rag Sorter b Russia Poland
Johnny Burmani (or Bowmani) 11 son born Widnes

1901 - 11 Water Street, Widnes, Prescot RG13 / 3515 / 49 / 17
Martha Buman 34 widow born Poland
Joseph Buman 13 son
Margaret Buman 5 daur b Poland
John Buman under 1 month born Widnes

[pat fowles]

Thank you Jomot1. They seem the likeliest links so far.

[pat fowles]

I've looked at both the 1901 & 1911 census'. Neither have been any help finding a birth record for John, or death record for his father August. But wow...how interesting the census records are, and how lucky we are to have them. 1901 has the family living in Widnes. The majority of people on the page from Poland. Most are working as Chemical labourer'. Widnes at that time was described as a 'poisonous hell town'. 1911 has them in Collyhurst Manchester. Mother and daughter working as Rag sorters with the word 'Shoddy' next to the occupation. Shoddy was the recycling of wool to be made into something else. Amazing history.

[Lesley Robertson]

It’s not really help to your search, but this is a very good example of how some surnames could mutate to more familiar spellings!

[Jomot1]

If national BMD registration wasn't a requirement back home, then its possible that his birth wasn't registered. I've found that Catholics in particular tended to baptise their children quite quickly but then not register them.

I've been trying to locate the other members of the family after 1911 but without much success. A sister s named on the army record but I've not had much luck in tracing her: Mrs Millar, 72 Red Bank, Cheetham Hill

As for older brother Joseph, a possibility might be the 1913 Catholic marriage in Liverpool of Josephum Burenskas to Martham [Marcellam] Thvilaitute, although this man's father is given as Antonii, not Augustini

The GRO has the marriage listed as Juozas Burninskas and Marcele Ikvilaicute.

By 1921 this family is at 14, Birchall Street, Manchester, as Jonas and Marcella, although they give two alternative surnames as Burinkas or Borinski.

I don't think were allowed to reproduce the 1921 census, but these seem to be their children:

BURINSKY, MAGGIE mmn MICKOLIKA GRO Reference: 1914 M Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 37
BURINCKAS, JOSEPH mmn MIKOLAITIS GRO Reference: 1916 M Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 7
BURINSKY, MARY mmn MIKOLAITIS GRO Reference: 1919 M Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 56

Maggie is baptised 28 Dec 1913 (born 22nd) as Magdalena Burinski
Joseph on 28 Nov 1915 (born 10th) as Joseph Burinskie
I can't find one for Mary.

I used to work with someone of Polish descent and his surname ended SKI and his wife's ended SKA, so I'm assuming that differing male/female surnames is a polish 'thing', but I havent looked into it.

[Pam Downes]

Whilst fiddling around, wasting time, I came across these three datasets on Ancestry.
Poland, Jewish Records Indexing-Poland, Births, 1550-1993
Poland, Jewish Records Indexing-Poland, Marriages, 1798-1939
Poland, Jewish Records Indexing-Poland, Deaths, 1808-1942

Note these are Jewish records, and the family may not have been Jewish. All it says for John's baptism is that it was Non-Conformist.

If you search the Polish records, do read all the information about them. From the speed-reading I did, it would seem that the index has been compiled on a town-by-town basis, and there are a lot of towns that have still to be indexed.

[pat fowles]

I've also tried to follow the people on the census'. The names vary so much it's pretty much impossible. I'm not sure if they were Jewish. Judging by the amount of people from Poland working in Widnes in 1901 I think they probably came for work and not because they were Jewish. I'll keep looking. Thank you everyone for your help.