JACOBS: Moses b. Phillip & Elias b. Eliezer

[Eve Mary]

In the 1841 England Census, Isabela JACOBS (age 3) is with the household of Moses JACOBS (Moshe b. Uri/Aryeh Shraga Pais), son of Phillip Jacobs, born Middlesex c.1789, and Anna/Hannah Hindel SOLOMON b.1796 (married 1814). Moses Jacobs had a brother Henry (Zvi Hirsh) (married Elizabeth MEYERS), and Moses' father Phillip's father was David.

I believe Isabella was Isabella daughter of Elias (Eliyahu b. Meir/Meyer b. Yaakov/Jacob pencil maker) JACOBS (Elias born London c. 1767), and Betsy (Breindla b. Yespe/Joseph Worms) LAZARUS, (married 1796).

Most of the above information is from synagogue records of marriages and births and the 1841 England Census. Spelling of names varies according to transcriber.

I'd like to know if Moses JACOBS and Elias JACOBS are related. They have different fathers, but their age difference suggests that Moses could be a nephew of Elias. Naming patterns of their respective children suggest otherwise and Isabella may have been staying with an unrelated family, but I'd like to be more certain.

[There is no name for Anna/Hannah Solomon's father in her and Moses Jacobs' marriage record. I do have, I think, all the early information from synagoguescribes about the LAZARUS of Worms family/ies. Annoyingly, I can't connect to synagoguescribes.com (or to a commercial genealogy site) to look further into possible relationships. So far, no link via these families suggests a link to JACOBS further back, but that could be because the women's names go unrecorded.]

Any help with Elias Jacobs and Moses Jacobs connections muchly appreciated. (They were both clothiers, but that was such a common trade that I can't infer a link from that.)

Eve

[Pam Downes]

Am I reading this incorrectly, or have you got at least one generation missing?

I believe Isabella was Isabella daughter of Elias (Eliyahu b. Meir/Meyer b. Yaakov/Jacob pencil maker) JACOBS (Elias born London c. 1767), and Betsy (Breindla b. Yespe/Joseph Worms) LAZARUS, (married 1796).

Yes, someone born in 1767 could be the father of someone born c 1838, but it's almost physically impossible for the child's mother to have married in 1796. The mother could have been married aged 14, which would make her about 52 in 1838.

It would be helpful if you could quote the census reference(s), or at the very least give addresses and registration districts so we know we are looking at the same family/families as you.

ADDED: Can't do maths tonight!
If someone was 14 in 1796, they would have been born 1782.
1782-1838 equals 56. So I would say, yes, physically impossible to have been the mother of a child born in 1838.

[christanel]

1841 census Piece 725 Book 1 Folio6 Page 7
Petticoat Square St Botolph Aldersgate
Moses Jacobs 52 Dealer
Anna Jacobs 45
Maria Jacobs 20
Leah Jacobs 16
Jane Jacobs 14
Betsey Jacobs 10
David Jacobs 6
Henry Jacobs 2
Isabella Jacobs 3

All born in County

[phillip]

Hi Eve
The Moses Jacobs line is part of my own Jacobs family history.Philip the father of Moses was the brother of Henry Jacobs who married Kitty Moses- Henry and Kitty are my 4 x great grandparents. The father of Henry and Philip et al is David Jacobs aka Letson aka Litzen- David is my 5x great grandfather.

The Jacobs family history is well documented on Jacobs family tree-Home of the Jacobs family online data base set up by cousin Dave Simpson some years ago. The data base has a wide range of records and sources on the lines and you can see how the original members of the group including me relate to each other. David Jacobs aka Letson was from Germany probably the place name Litzen - West Prussia now.

I will look more closely at the data and respond if possible to your query.

From the original data we did know who the wife of Philip Jacobs was

[phillip]

Hi Eve
Please look carefully at the data on Isabella Jacobs who appears in the 1841 Census in #3. See Jacobs Tree-Home of the a Jacobs Family Tree online data base under Isabella Jacobs b c 1837. She died in 1849 age 12. She was the illegitimate daughter of Maria Jacobs b 1821 see 1841 Census #3. There are Removal Papers for Moses Jacobs which identifies Isabella and her mother Maria- the father is unknown.

Isabella is the granddaughter of Moses Jacobs as per the Removal Order- see also Cemetery Scribes ID 1399 for Elias JACOBS aka JACOB c 1771-1856 and Elizabeth aka Betsy Lazarus c 1774-1833 which has 4 of his children listed-Lazarus b 1802,Catherine b 1814,Leah b 1816,Abraham b 1821. There is no Isabella and note the ages of Elias and Betsy.

[phillip]

I have traced Maria Jacobs following her marriage to Joseph Alexander and will post a new thread on the line which includes data on their children and the subsequent baptism of the entire family including Maria and Joseph.

[Pam Downes]

I have traced Maria Jacobs following her marriage to Joseph Alexander and will post a new thread on the line which includes data on their children and the subsequent baptism of the entire family including Maria and Joseph.

This is the new thread
https://www.british-genealogy.com/fo...827?highlight=