SILVER Walter Edward c1875

[fullscott]

A puzzle in the WW1 Service Records (MAR):

This man joined the Army Service Corps on 15 August 1899 as HARRY MARTIN.
Declared age 24y 4m, born Lambeth, so born c1875? (No birth found for SILVER)

He served as MARTIN, was convicted in a civil court for theft in 1905 and was discharged May 1913 with less than 6 years qualifying service. (So was he imprisoned for 8 years?)

Mother: Annie Elizabeth MARTIN (Clapham)
Older brother: George MARTIN (Yarmouth)

As Walter Edward SILVER he married Margaret Zilpha NICOLL on 19 April 1897 at St Judes Church, Kensal Green.(Which is before he joined up, when he declared himself as unmarried)

No clues in the Record, only a note "Alias Walter Edward Silver" on his Attestation.

Anc****y, MAR, pages 193673-193678

[Lesley Robertson]

If he was discharged in 1913, why is he in the WW1 records? Was he recalled?

[fullscott]

If he was discharged in 1913, why is he in the WW1 records? Was he recalled?

Because the papers are a SHAMBLES!
And should never have been called "WW1 Service Records".
There are many records in this "collection" that relate to soldiers who died before WW1 even started.

Jane

[Lesley Robertson]

Ah. I’ve been blaming the war for that, not incompetence.

[almach]

I haven't found anything further to add on Walter Edward Silver AKA Harry Martin.

Some records I have found

SILVER, ERNEST WALTER ANDREW, MMN NICOLL
GRO Reference: 1898 M Quarter in WANDSWORTH Volume 01D Page 661

I think Ernest Walter Andrew Silver goes to live in the U.S. or Canada

Margaret Silver (born Kensington) and her son, Ernest, are with her parents Andrew and Isabella Nicoll in 1901, RG13; Piece: 6; Folio: 110; Page: 7

In 1911 Margaret is entered as a widow, says married 5 years (does she mean in total, therefore suggesting she was widowed in 1902/3? Also says she has one child.

Margaret Z Silver, Death Age: 70
Jan-Feb-Mar, 1945, Westminster, vol 1a, page 499,
There is a will for Margaret, found in the index to wills.

Sorry, it's not a help in finding Mr Silver/Martin's birth or, his life after he left the army.

In what name was he sentenced to prison?

[fullscott]

Thanks for looking, Almach.
I have no further information (just filing the soldiers - I'll file him under both names.)

Poor Margaret - it looks as though he gives a false name, gets her "in trouble" and runs off. But at least he married her (was a shotgun involved, d'you think?). Respectability at all costs.

Jane

[christanel]

The original image of the marriage says his father is Arthur Silver a carpenter. Both he and Margaret are of full age. Both living at 315 Shirland Road. Walter Edward occupation a Wine? ??? One f the witnesses is a Jessie Janet Nicholl and the other a George ?? ??
Christina

[almach]

Walter Edward occupation a Wine? ???

I think it's wine butler. His service papers have his occupation as clerk.

[christanel]

The original image of the marriage says his father is Arthur Silver a carpenter. Both he and Margaret are of full age. Both living at 315 Shirland Road. Walter Edward occupation a Wine? ??? One f the witnesses is a Jessie Janet Nicholl and the other a George ?? ??
Christina

1901 census
RG13 Piece 1195 Folio 76 Page 58
23 Brooks Road Brentford.
Arthur J Silver 36 Carpenter and joiner, Isleworth Middlesex Too young to be Harry Martin's father
Ellen C Silver 29 Wife Farnham, Surrey
Thomas W Silver 4 Brentford, Middlesex
Kate P Silver 3 Brentford, Middlesex
Alfred E Silver 1 Brentford, Middlesex
Thomas G Page 10 brother-in-law

1871 Piece 1319 Folio 86 Page 32
Marquis ??, Ealing, Brentford.
Thomas Silver 46 Head Publican Brentford, Middlesex
Emily Silver 36 Wife London
Thomas Silver 11 Son Isleworth, Middlesex
Emily Silver 9 Dau Isleworth, Middlesex
Arthur Silver 6 Son Isleworth, Middlesex
Sophia Silver 4 Dau Isleworth, Middlesex
Edward Martin 20 Lodger, labourer Brentford, Middlesex, Too old to be Harry Martin.
Harry Purdy 30 Lodger Brentford, Middlesex

It's all getting a bit convoluted.
Christina