Some baptisms at Braintree (transcripts only)
30 Aug 1837 (born 1 Aug 1837) John s/o James & Mary Potter, Labourer
1 May 1839 (born 2 Apr 1839) Eliza d/o James & Mary Potter, Labourer**
5 Jun 1844 (born 3 May 1844) Eliza d/o Mary Potter, Widow
14 Mar 1868 (aged 21) Roseina d/o James & Mary Potter, Labourer
**Burial 15 Jun 1840 Eliza Potter, infant
Results 11 to 20 of 23
Thread: James Potter Greenwich Pensioner
-
06-02-2022, 2:06 AM #11
- Join Date
- Feb 2018
- Location
- England
- Posts
- 1,440
-
06-02-2022, 2:23 AM #12
- Join Date
- Feb 2018
- Location
- England
- Posts
- 1,440
1841 at Pound Lane, Braintree
Mary Potter 35 Wash Woman
William 15
James 10
John 3 (broadly matches the 1837 baptism)
-
06-02-2022, 3:58 AM #13
Thank you Pam and Jomot1.
Pam
William Hedges and Eliza Potter are my great-great-grandparents.
My great-grandmother's (Alice Matilda Hedges) death certificate gives her parents as William Hedges, soldier, and Eliza Hedges nee Potter.
That led me to the marriage certificate of William Hedges, aged 21, Lance Corporal in 55th Regt, and Eliza Potter, aged 20. Eliza's father is given as "James Potter, labourer".
After extensive research in English records (believing a family myth), Eliza's death certificate was eventually located under our very noses. She died in Wellington, New Zealand, in 1882, at the age of 39 years. She was born in "England", and had married William Hedges at the age of 20. Her parents were given as "John Potter, labourer", and "Mary Potter". Since Eliza was present at her wedding I assumed that "James Potter" recorded on the marriage certificate would be more likely to be correct (that may still be the case).
I was able to locate the birth certificates of her two daughters, Alice Matilda 1863, baptised Braintree 1864, and Emma 1871, baptised Chukrata 1871, but not for her son William. Both daughters registered in the Army Register Book of Births Baptisms and Marriages.
Army records show that William Hedges was born in Braintree and was a weaver by trade. He served in India, avoiding the 1871 census, and returned to England in 1873. Army record show that "William Hedges listed on married establishment on 4 September 1867 Wife Eliza, child Alice Matilda 3 years 9 months"
Shipping records show:-
The Golden Sea sailed 23 January 1874, and arrived 1 May 1874, Wellington
3½ adults £50 15s
William Hedges 33 Essex Gardener
Eliza Hedges 31
Alice M Hedges 10
William Hedges 4
Emma Hedges 2
Pam and Jomot1
Your efforts have given me a new angle to work on.
Since Eliza Potter married in Portsea I assumed that was because she was from Portsea, and hence my interest in James Potter in Portsea in the 1861 census.
Your efforts have caused me to consider another explanation for Eliza's appearance in Portsea. Perhaps, as you suggest, Jomot1, the Potters and Hedges families were well acquainted with each other and in order to marry William, Eliza had to go to Portsea, and she was accommodated in the barracks as a courtesy.
Thanks again, you have set my endeavours on another track.
-
06-02-2022, 5:00 AM #14
- Join Date
- Feb 2018
- Location
- England
- Posts
- 1,440
Possibly a red herring, but there is an army record (Royal Hospital Chelsea: Admission Books) dated 10 Feb 1836 for a James Potter of Braintree aged 42.
He had been a private in the 19th Foot Regiment for 22 years & 10 months and was discharged due to age & infirmity. Born Braintree but intended place of residence was Sunderland. A later record shows Newcastle.
He can be found in the census in Sunderland 1841-1861 with wife Catherine (nee Munro, born Ireland) and an assortment of children.
It seems rather odd that James the husband of Mary in Braintree never appears in the census with her and is clearly not the biological father of several of the children, and at the same time there is a James Potter born Braintree with a family in Sunderland. Hmmm.....
-
06-02-2022, 9:19 AM #15
Hmmm indeed
What appeals to me about James Potter in Portsea in 1861 is just that .... in Portsea in 1861, so if he had a daughter named Eliza it does not stretch the imagination much that she should marry in Portsea. Also James' mother appears to be Alice ..... hence Alice Matilda Hedges. However the big "IF" here is IF he had a daughter named Eliza ... and if he did where is she in the 1851 census.
What appeals to me about Jomot1's suggestion of Eliza being the daughter of James and Mary Potter in Braintree is that there is an easy connection between the Hedges and Potter families. Also this Eliza had a sister named Matilda. The only fly in this ointment is that this Eliza was born in 1844, which is at odds with other records like marriage record, "Golden Sea" passenger list, and Eliza (Potter) Hedges death certificate which indicate a birth in 1842/43.
As an side, Alice Matilda Hedges was extremely guarded in revealing her exact age. In all cases, marriage certificate, and five of the birth certificates of her seven children, she gave an age which indicated her birth as being in 1860/61. The other two certificates indicate she was born 1863/64. In fact her birth certificate shows that she was born on 30 September 1863. Combine this with her date of marriage 18 September 1878 it can be easily understood why Alice Matilda was happy to pass herself as three years older. And for the record the first child was born 22 months after the wedding.
There are a couple of other Eliza Potter (born in 1842 (plus-minus) and daughters of James Potter) I have investigated but the problem I have with them is I cannot see how the paths of William Hedges and Eliza Potter would cross. No such problem with the Braintree Potters. Perhaps Alice Matilda can teach me a lesson about being too rigid with recorded ages and the resulting implied dates of birth....
Thanks again for some useful suggestions and insight.
-
06-02-2022, 8:28 PM #16
- Join Date
- Feb 2018
- Location
- England
- Posts
- 1,440
Well I think my head may possibly be about to explode!
It looks like Matilda Potter born 1846 marries William Potter in Braintree on 31 Oct 1861. From the census he was born c1825, and I think he may be the 15-year-old William Potter in the 1841 census with Mary at Pound Lane, Braintree. This is from the transcript of the marriage:
William Potter, bachelor, Braintree. Father: James Potter, Labourer
Matilda Potter, spinster, Braintree. Father: Robert Duncombe, Brush Maker
We know that Matilda was illegitimate from her birth registration and Eliza's baptism showing Mary as an alleged widow, so it looks very much like Matilda may have married her step-brother.
They're certainly turning out to be an interesting bunch, whether they belong to DBCoup's family or not!
There is a service record for a William Potter born c1825 Brayntree (sic) - attested 19 Jan 1844 aged 19. Service No. 2368, 1/24th Reg Of Infantry. Discharged in Ireland in 1864 with the intended residence of Ironstile, Cattlemarket, Braintree.
William & Matilda can be found in later census in Plumstead/Woolwich
It looks like Rosina followed them there and in 1870 gave birth to an illegitimate daughter, Alice Matilda Potter. ("Alice Matilda" - another link to Eliza Hedges )
These two baptisms at Woolwich on 14 May 1871 confirm its the right Rosina:
Matilda Louisa d/o William & Matilda Potter, 39 Eton Street, Plumstead (born 2 Mar 1871)
Alice Matilda d/o Rosina Potter, 39 Eton Street, Plumstead (born 3 Feb 1870).
-
07-02-2022, 4:13 AM #17
An interesting bunch indeed! Intriguing that "Alice Matilda" is repeated ....
Something else to add to the picture
James Potter, widower! married Mary Wendon, 21 April 1833, Braintree, Essex. The way this is all shaping up it would not surprise me if James was not a widower .....
-
07-02-2022, 4:54 AM #18
- Join Date
- Oct 2004
- Location
- England
- Posts
- 9,620
-
07-02-2022, 12:56 PM #19
- Join Date
- Feb 2018
- Location
- England
- Posts
- 1,440
5 Jun 1844 (born 3 May 1844) Eliza d/o Mary Potter, Widowperhaps Eliza was registered under a different surname, or just not registered at all??
WRIGHT, ELIZA mmn WENDON GRO Reference: 1844 J Quarter in BRAINTREE, ESSEX Volume 12 Page 24
-
08-02-2022, 6:46 AM #20
Wow Jomot1 you are certainly on a roll with this. I have been popping in since the thread started and soon lost the plot (par for the course these days
We Mods do miss the 'Thank You" button that disappeared when the site was upgraded a good while back because we are so appreciative of all the help given and the knowledge our members happily pass on.
ChristinaSometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
William Burroughs
Helping you trace your British Family History & British Genealogy.
All times are GMT. The time now is 6:29 PM.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5
Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.
Bookmarks