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  1. #11
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Found

    Samuel John FRANCIS, mmn TEMBY
    GRO Reference 1862 June Quarter in REDRUTH Vol 5C Page 275

    Still not finding a birth reg for James A using all the tricks I can think of.
    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  2. #12
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BFran1 View Post
    I'm in awe! I'm also humbled by the help you've already given me! I need to record this data and look into signing up for access to the GRO.
    In your opinion, then, the 1868 DOB seems more accurate?
    Wow! Thank you, Christina.
    Definitely more accurate but I still can't find a birth registration for him.
    This is not unusual because from 1837 to 1874? it was not a legally binding requirement for them to be registered by the parents and fines for not doing so were only introduced in 1874 but it does seem a little off kilter that Joseph and Elizabeth wouldn't have registered James when they did register the older children.

    Cyndi's List is a good site which gives you links to both free and pay sites https://www.cyndislist.com/
    Click on Categories on the left then 'U' for United Kingdom and Ireland

    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  3. #13
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    1861 RG9 Piece 1580 Folio 123 Page 18
    East Turnpike Redruth
    Samuel Francis 46 Copper miner Redruth
    Mary Ann Francis 43 Redruth
    Joseph Francis 21 copper miner Gwennap,
    John Francis 18 copper miner Gwennap,
    Elizabeth Francis 15 Mine girl. St Agnes
    James Francis 13 Mason? Gwennap,
    Samuel Francis 10 scholar Gwennap,
    Thomas Francis 7 Gwennap,
    Mary Ann Francis 5 Gwennap,
    Eliza Francis 2 Gwennap,

    1851 HO107 Piece 1914 Folio 102 Page 11
    Treskerby Redruth
    Samuel Francis 36 copper miner born Redruth
    Mary Ann Francis 33 Redruth
    Joseph Francis 11 Redruth
    John Francis 8 Gwenapp
    Elizabeth Francis 5 St Agnes
    James Francis 3 Gwennap
    Samuel Francis 7 Months Gwennap

    1841 HO107 Piece 137 Book 7 Folio 47 Page 8
    Gwennap With St Day
    Sam Francis 25 Copper miner
    Mary Francis 22
    Joseph Francis 1
    All born in county

    Marriage
    Samuel Francis
    Marriage Date 7 September 1839
    Marriage Place - St. Day, Cornwall, England
    Spouse - Mary Ann Vivian
    FHL Film Number - 1595485

    You should be able to find this marriage on the familysearch.org site which is also free and a great resource. You can also search for the censuses but if on there will only have a transcript, not the original document.

    Samuel Francis

    Baptism - 11 September 1814
    Baptism Place - Redruth, Cornwall, England
    Father - Joseph Francis
    Mother - Mary
    FHL Film Number - 916958, 916960

    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  4. #14
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BFran1 View Post
    My grandmother's name was Mabel Aldrich. She was born in 1887 and died in 1944. She had an illegitimate son whose given name was George. While my grandmother was alive he used Francis as his last name and sometime after her death he used the surname Simmons. Between James and Mabel there were four known pregnancies. James was born 1914 and died as an infant. Next was Helen (1917-2001), Then Ruth (1920 - 1995) and then my father Charles (1928 - 1976)
    In this Rhode Island 1915 census James has knocked some years off his age and is claiming to be born in Nova Scotia!

    Woonsocket Ward 3, Providence
    James Francis 43 born Nova Scotia, mother and father born Nova Scotia, occupation Teamster for a private family,
    Mabel Francis 25 born USA Parents born USA
    George Francis 9 born Nova Scotia
    James Francis 1 born USA, father born Nova Scotia, mother born USA
    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  5. #15
    Growing old Disgracefully
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    Thanks Christanel for posting all that saved me doing it. I found the same as you but had to go out so couldn't post it.

  6. #16
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    FS have another James A Francis in Boulder Colorado. He married an Eliza J Todd in 1896 and the couple can be found in various censuses. Born England 1869. Died in Boulder 1931.

  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by christanel View Post
    In this Rhode Island 1915 census James has knocked some years off his age and is claiming to be born in Nova Scotia!

    Woonsocket Ward 3, Providence
    James Francis 43 born Nova Scotia, mother and father born Nova Scotia, occupation Teamster for a private family,
    Mabel Francis 25 born USA Parents born USA
    George Francis 9 born Nova Scotia
    James Francis 1 born USA, father born Nova Scotia, mother born USA
    Christina
    Thank you, again! I have previously seen this. I realized it was not accurate. Mabel would have been 28 in 1915 and, of course, James would have been 47 This was the only instance I have seen where his origins were attributed to Canada. Many of the records I found for George indicate his place of birth was New York (although even he didn't know where, in the state of New York, he ws born). I have to wonder if the census worker made a mistake? I found it interesting that the children's (George and James) ages were accurate. I have to wonder why they gave false information. I've found a lot of misinformation out there on this couple. It's made researching them quite frustrating, at times.

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by grisel View Post
    FS have another James A Francis in Boulder Colorado. He married an Eliza J Todd in 1896 and the couple can be found in various censuses. Born England 1869. Died in Boulder 1931.
    I have found other references for James Francis in and around that time/place. I found one in the records of the LDS (Latter Day Saints) church records that show a James Francis, son of Joseph and Hattie Davis (not the only time that name has come up), marrying a Mormon woman - Margaret Ann Brown - in 1880. They had two children - Albert (b.1881) and Pearl (b. 1883). The birth place for those children was given as St. Charles, Idaho (just over the state line from Utah). After that, there were no further records connecting James to this family. She later re-married. My thought was that he had abandoned this family and went east to Rhode Island. It was, perhaps, the reason he and Mabel never legally married... if that James was my grandfather.

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