James McKenzie

[Mickspic]

Hi all, I have a problem with fitting my Great Grand father into the tree. The info I have is he was born somewhere in Scotland and joined the Forfarshire Regiment of the army. I have a notation that he lived in Dundee at the time but have no citation for this. He moved to Dublin and was garrisoned in Beggars Bush Barracks. He married Catherine Dorman in 1878 in Dublin and I have the certificate. He had a number of children, one of whom died in Suvla Bay. I believe this was either Thomas or John McKenzie.
I would love to have some validation of any of this, especially the military records and where in Scotland he came from. I appreciate you reading and possibly unlocking some of the mystery.
Thank You
Gerry O Connor

[christanel]

Hi Gerry and welcome to the Brit-Gen forums.
Can you give us the details on James and Catherine's marriage certificate? Their ages, their occupations their parents names and occupations, addresses. If a Scottish marriage certificate No, I have just realised that they married in Dublin so the marriage certificate will not be as informative as a Scottish one.
Are these their children? Found on a public tree on ancestry.com
John McKenzie 7 MAY 1880
Mary Ellen McKenzie 12 OCT 1883
Catherine McKenzie 1887–1888
James McKenzie 25 OCT 1889
Ellen McKenzie 1892–1892
Hannah Ellen McKenzie 1893
Louise McKenzie ??
Catherine died 1903 and James 28 November 1925 in Ireland.

Christina

[Lesley Robertson]

Do you know his birth year? When he joined the army? Anything that would make him stand out from others of the same name? Did they return to Scotland?

PS Welcome in!

[Pam Downes]

Marriage 11 May 1877, not 1878, at the Register office, Dublin South.

James McKenzie, of full age, bachelor, Private 93rd, living [Bigginsbank? Beggarsbank?] Barracks, Co Dublin, father John McKenzie, engineer.

Katherine Dorman, of full age, spinster, no occupation given, 23 Up(per) Mount Street, City Dublin, father William Dorman,, steward.

Image available via https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en/
Click civil records.

Based on the children Christina found in that family tree, I presume this is (part of) the family in the 1901 census.
Living Townsend Street, Trinity Ward, Dublin
James McKenzie, 46, Quay labourer, I would interpret his birthplace as a badly written and spelt Edinburgh
Kate, for her age take your pick of 40, 44, 46 (transcribed as 44), born Co Wicklow
James, 10, born Dublin
Louise, 6, born Dublin

Death registration Dublin South
Died 20 October 1901, think it says in the Workhouse, Catherine McKenzie, Townsend Street, 42 years, labourer's wife.
Again, image available via link given for marriage registration.

1911 census
Living Denzille Street, Trinity Ward, Dublin
James McKenzie, 56, carpet planner, born Scotland
John, son, 29, carpet planner,
Jamesie (sic), son, 20, messanger (sic) hotel,
Mary, daur, 26, housemaid,
Louisa, daur, 16, scholar
All children born City Dublin.
Against James' name it says he is a widower, and his marriage has lasted 33 years (that was actually how many years ago he married). Illegible number of children born alive, but only four still living.

Census entries and images can be found at https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/

James died 28 November 1925. As with all the other registrations, click on name in results, then scroll down the page a little, past the details, and you'll see an 'image' link.

The link for the marriage and death registrations also has a church records tab which you could check for baptisms of the children and Catherine/Katherine.

To search for James in Scotland, you need Scotland's People. https://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/
You have to register, but it's free to search, only needing to pay to see further details. Transcriptions of Scottish census are available on Findmypast and Ancestry, and you could also try FreeCEN. It's not complete, but in some of the census Scotland is very well represented.
https://www.freecen.org.uk/

Pam

[Mickspic]

Hi Lesley, Thank you for the welcome. I have given the dates, as I have them, to Christina, another moderator. They did not live in Scotland, in fact see Pam Downs' reply. She hit the nail on the head.

Gerry

[Mickspic]

Thank you Pam for your research. This is the family in question, the Jamesie is my grandfather who dies when I was 8 so I didn't really know him.
You mentioned a tab on the death cert which leads to church records. I am at a loss as to where this is. Can you elaborate please? I am assuming that the missing son Thomas, born 1878, has already joined the army, but I know assumptions are a dangerous beast in genealogy.
I will search Scotland's people as suggested, perhaps I will be back with more questions at a later time.

Gerry

[Mickspic]

Pam, by the way, the barracks is Beggars Bush Barracks, now government offices and a printing museum. Located in Dublin South inner city. I have been there not knowing my link to it.
Gerry

[Pam Downes]

Thank you Pam for your research. This is the family in question, the Jamesie is my grandfather who dies when I was 8 so I didn't really know him.
You mentioned a tab on the death cert which leads to church records. I am at a loss as to where this is. Can you elaborate please? I am assuming that the missing son Thomas, born 1878, has already joined the army, but I know assumptions are a dangerous beast in genealogy.
I will search Scotland's people as suggested, perhaps I will be back with more questions at a later time.

Gerry

You've misinterpreted what I said.

The link for the marriage and death registrations also has a church records tab which you could check for baptisms of the children and Catherine/Katherine.

A registration is not the same as a certificate.
So the quick way of explaining is - across the top of the page at
https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en/
you've got home, church records, civil records, etc.
Click on the church records tab.

Don't forget to search for death registrations for the children who have died according to the 1911 census. 'Tis a pity that the number of children born alive is not absolutely clear (well, not to my eyes). They might be in the burial of the church records but by then probably most city burials took place in a cemetery rather than a churchyard.
It might be worth trying the British Newspaper Archive for any announcements of the McKenzie name in the Dublin papers. You might have to register but you can search for free. All but the latest updates of the BNA are available on Findmypast (FMP).

Pam

[Mickspic]

That you Pam for clearing that up. I have never examined the church records only the civil. You live and learn as they say.
Gerry