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  1. #1
    Starting to feel at home biggirlsblouse's Avatar
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    Default Ann Wragg and John Smith

    Greetings,

    I have got myself in a quandary - that's what happens when you start revisiting things you thought were true!

    My 3X great grandfather John Smith married a lady called Ann Wragg in 1844. According to her marriage certificate, both she and John were "of age" and in census records for 1851 and 1861, Ann Wragg Smith is listed as being born in Derbyshire.

    Now, I've blithely decided her parents are Peter Wragg and Grace Smedley - they're from Derbyshire, they have a kid that's the right age in the 1841 census, all good, nothing to see here.

    BUT - on closer inspection of her marriage certificate, it pretty clearly states her father's name is THOMAS Wragg, and not Peter. And there's no mistaking one for the other.

    So, I've been trying to work out whether Thomas is actually Ann's father, or if he was another relative, and where I got the idea that Peter Wragg was involved (he died before she got married).

    In 1851, her year of birth is listed as 1818; but in 1861, it's listed as 1821. Now, her husband probably filled in the census or answered the questions back in 1851 - but he'd died by 1861 - which makes me think the 1821 year of birth might be more likely to be accurate - which wipes out Ann Wragg daughter of Peter!

    But I can't find any ANN Wragg daughter of Thomas - I can find a couple of Hannahs and some Mary Anns. I don't know if I'm too hung up on her being in Derbyshire, or if she moved earlier...

    I did find a likely-ish Ann in West Bromwich, who matches the age of the 1861 Ann, and is about 3 miles away (ish my geography is terrible) from where John Smith was living in 1841

    Anyway, before I take the chainsaw to her branch of the tree, and reinstate Thomas as her rightful father... can someone help me confirm that Thomas is indeed Ann's actual father, that the Ann in West Bromwich is plausible and it's time to sharpen the chainsaw!

    Jodi

  2. #2
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    Default

    There is a baptism at Bonsall, Derby on 18 March 1818 for Ann Wragg Parents are Peter Wragg and Grace.

  3. #3

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    These look promising as born in Ashover Derbyshire, living Birmingham

    1851, Birmingham, S t Paul. HO107; Piece: 2051; Folio: 607; Page: 50
    Thomas Wragg 56, stone mason, Ashover Derbyshire
    Ann Wragg 56, Ashover Derbyshire
    Charles Wragg 22, gun smith, Ashover Derbyshire
    Margret Wragg 19, straw bonnet maker, Ashover Derbyshire
    James Wragg 14, Coventry

    Although indexed on Ancestry as Wingg, the original sheet says WRAGG
    1841, St Thomas, Birmingham HO107; Piece: 1147; Book: 2; Folio: 17; Page: 26
    Thomas Wingg 45, stone mason (not born in county)
    Ann Wingg 45, (not born in county)
    Enoch Wingg 25, (not born in county)
    Thomas Wingg 15, (not born in county)
    Charles Wingg 13, (not born in county)
    Margaret Wingg 10
    James Wingg 4
    Alma

  4. #4

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    There's this marriage for a Thomas Wragg

    Thomas Wragg/Ann Slack, 17th March 1823, Ashover. The marriage is after Ann's birth, also after the birth of Enoch (25 in 1841). I think Enoch was born illegitimately to Ann Slack and if Ann (dau) does belong to this family she too was born when Ann (mother) was single.

    I've found a baptism for Enoch, he's Enoch Paul Slack, base-born to Ann Slack.

    https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61...A1%3AQGKZ-MD63
    Alma

  5. #5
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    In 1841 how about Ann Ragg 20 with John Smith , St George St Birmingham
    Piece 1141, folio 26 p 8

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by almach View Post
    There's this marriage for a Thomas Wragg

    Thomas Wragg/Ann Slack, 17th March 1823, Ashover. The marriage is after Ann's birth, also after the birth of Enoch (25 in 1841). I think Enoch was born illegitimately to Ann Slack and if Ann (dau) does belong to this family she too was born when Ann (mother) was single.

    I've found a baptism for Enoch, he's Enoch Paul Slack, base-born to Ann Slack.

    https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61...A1%3AQGKZ-MD63
    Well found almach. FS have a baptism Ann Eliza Slack , mother Ann, Ashover 25 Oct 1818.

  7. #7
    Starting to feel at home biggirlsblouse's Avatar
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    I reckon the "Wingg" family are the Wraggs I am looking for in 1941 - the Thomas Wragg I am looking for is a stonemason!

    Yay! Chainsaw here I come!

  8. #8
    Starting to feel at home biggirlsblouse's Avatar
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    OOOOH!!!! Now, that is also quite interesting! It's definitely the right John - because *my* John is a brewer/publican and I reckon that's probably a pub they live at!

    Also means John is 10 years older than Ann rather than nearly 20 years older!

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