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  1. #1
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    Default Looking for advice about 2 birth dates

    Hey all,

    I'm new here and hope this is the right place to post my question.

    I'm currently researching my mother-in-law's family tree and having some confusion over her great uncle HENRY JOHN PITMAN

    I know for sure HENRY's parents were ROBERT HENRY PITMAN (1876-) and HARRIET ELIZABETH MARIA MAHONEY (1847-1905)

    There are 2 baptism records for HENRY JOHN PITMAN, with the same parents listed above. One is from 14 Oct 1876 at All Saints Church in Walworth/Newington, Surrey, England, the other is from 23 Sep 1877, at Saint Nicholas, Brighton, Sussex.

    The baptism record from 14 Oct 1876 lists the birth date as 16 Aug 1876, but there is also a birth registration from July 1877.

    My initial thought was there was another HENRY JOHN who died and so they named their next child the same name.

    However, they had another son, FREDERICK PITMAN, who was born in 1874, and was ALSO baptized 23 Sep 1877 at Saint Nicholas, Brighton, Sussex. This makes me think maybe they had HENRY initially baptized but never registered him, and then moved, registered him the next year and then had HENRY and FREDERICK baptized?

    Hoping someone might have some ideas about this.

    Thank you for your time,

    Chris Marsland

  2. #2
    Loves to help with queries
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    Henry John Pitman was definitely registered in Sept qu 1876 in Camberwell district. A GRO check confirms his mum to be Mahoney. There are actually 2 records of his registration on Freebmd. Again using GRO one did not come up with mum's maiden name but the other did. Someone else may be able to explain this.

  3. #3
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    Apologies, the father ROBERT HENRY PITMANs birth year is 1846, not 1876

  4. #4
    Brick wall demolition expert!
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    Default

    They are two separate boys.

    Births
    1876 Sept Quarter Camberwell Volume 1d Page 744
    1877 Sept Quarter Brighton Volume 2b Page 252

    Both have mother's maiden name as Mahoney

    Deaths
    1876 Dec Quarter Saint Saviour, Surrey Vol 1d Page 75

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by loobylou View Post
    Henry John Pitman was definitely registered in Sept qu 1876 in Camberwell district. A GRO check confirms his mum to be Mahoney. There are actually 2 records of his registration on Freebmd. Again using GRO one did not come up with mum's maiden name but the other did. Someone else may be able to explain this.
    There is only one entry - two transcribers on FreeBMD have entered different page numbers (one incorrectly), so it appears on their index twice.

  6. #6
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Default

    Originally Posted by loobylou
    Henry John Pitman was definitely registered in Sept qu 1876 in Camberwell district. A GRO check confirms his mum to be Mahoney. There are actually 2 records of his registration on Freebmd. Again using GRO one did not come up with mum's maiden name but the other did. Someone else may be able to explain this.
    On the GRO index I entered the year of registration as 1876 +/- 1 using the name Henry without the John and did not enter a mother's maiden name. 4 entries came up. Two as below and two others both with the middle name Charles and mmn's Bowler and Davies. I didn't get an entry without a mmn.
    PITMAN, Henry John mmn Mahoney
    GRO Reference - 1876 Sept 1/4 in CAMBERWELL Volume 01D Page 744
    PITMAN, Henry John mmn Mahoney
    GRO Reference 1877 Sept 1/4 in BRIGHTON Volume 02B Page 252

    I think Megan has shown what happened to the first born Henry John and as was not unusual then the son born the year after was given the same name. Between 1860-1876 there is only one marriage of a Pitman to a Mahon*y and that is Robert and Harriet's. Her surname registered as Mahony. The only other is of a Rebecca Pitman.
    Luckily it is the same parents for both children (purchasing the second birth certificate would confirm this) so you do not have to scrap your research and start over.
    Birth years on censuses can be a year out depending on the person's birth month and also depending on the parent's ability to remember when each child was born, birth dates weren't as important back then.
    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  7. #7
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    Thank you everyone, really appreciate the help. I'd forgotten about that GRO site, I'll have to go there first thing!

    Now that I know this is a friendly forum, I hope you won't mind me asking many more question! hehe

    Cheers,

    Chris

  8. #8
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Go right ahead and ask as many questions as you like Chris. We all love to help others and sort out mysteries and we learn stuff as we do it too.
    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by Megan Roberts View Post
    They are two separate boys.


    Deaths
    1876 Dec Quarter Saint Saviour, Surrey Vol 1d Page 75
    FindMypast Burials

    Place - Victoria Park Cemetery, Hackney

    Henry John Pitman, abode - Mann(?) St, Walworth, burial date - 21 Nov 1876, age 2 mths, no. of grave - 0028, no. of receipt - 3339
    "dyfal donc a dyr y garreg"

  10. #10

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    Address confirmed as "Mann St" - it disappeared as part of 1960's development of Walworth. Now covered by the Aylesbury Estate.
    "dyfal donc a dyr y garreg"

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