WWI soldier commemorated at Thiepval

[phil.isherwood]

Hi,

I have an ancestor, James Ashton Isherwood of the 218 Field Coy, Royal Engineers, who is commemorated on the Thiepval memorial, implying that he is one of the missing whose body was never recovered for burial. His date of death is recorded as 20/3/1918 in all records I've found for him (Service Record, Pension Record, Commonwealth War Graves Commission).

I ordered up his will this week (from https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/#wills) in the rush to cash in on the price reduction from £10 to £1.50 per will. Most of the information in the will can be found in the other records, except it gives his place of death as Belgium!

Question: Why would he be commemorated at Thiepval, in the Somme sector, if he died in Belgium (i.e. the Ypres sector)?

I would be grateful for your thoughts and advice.

Many thanks,
Phil.

[emeltee]

Possibly a question for the CWGC?

Emeltee

[Lesley Robertson]

Welcome to the British Genealogy Forum, Phil.

Your best bet might be to find the War Diary for his unit. The War Diaries don't generally mention the lower ranks by name, but it should at least tell you where they were. I see that Ancestry's War Diaries Section has a lot of entries for them (but you have to fiddle with the date selection). They moved a lot. From 14 to 26 March they were at Partonnerres Farm 20T28C. If you Google for it, remember to also mention WW1 or you get all sorts of odd stuff.

It looks like it might have been northern France, but I suspect the borders were pretty blurred back then. Many men died at the aid stations, and were buried there until the end of the War when they were moved to the official cemetaries.

The alternative might be the casualty lists in the newspapers of the time.

BTW don't forget that most of the men on the Memorials probably did have proper burials, but for many reasons their headstones read "Known unto God", "A soldier of the Great War" or something similar. Sometimes they could identify and name a regiment. I don't know whether anyone has ever compared the numbers of nameless headstones with the number of names on the memorials.

[simmo1]

Hi

It could be just a simple clerical error!

regards

Robert

[Ernest47]

You could apply for his military death certificate. If you are lucky his unit will have recorded his place of death as either France or Belgium. However, sometimes they would just record "France and Flanders", which was the theatre of war.

[barbara lee]

The death date of 20 Mar 1918 is the day before the German offensive called Operation Michael, which started on 21st in the vicinity of St Quentin. Wikipedia has plenty on it. The Germans advanced so fast that the British fell back in some disarray and didn't start to bring their records up to date for about 10 days.
Plenty of opportunity for clerical errors there.
B

[Ernest47]

The Register of Soldiers' Effects give his place of death as Belgium. That's pretty serious evidence. I would consider presenting this to the CWGC. They may not have any material to confirm country of death. In the circumstances it might be worth doing what I mentioned earlier and obtain a copy of his death certificate in that hope that it will confirm the country of death as Belgium.

[Peter Goodey]

Has anyone looked at his service record or the company war diaries?

The war diaries indicate that the 218th Field Company was in Belgium in March 1918.

[Lesley Robertson]

Yes Peter, I did. That’s how I knew which War Diary to consult.... I just wasn’t sure about the location of the farm.

[Peter Goodey]

I mentioned the service record because it is stamped "445th Welsh Res. Field Coy., R.E.". I haven't been able to trace anything about that company but it might suggest possible scope for confusion.