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  1. #1
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    Default CLARKE FAMILY OF BRIDGEND/NEATH AREA

    I would very much appreciate some help with finding information for
    primarily births and deaths for four Clarke boys.

    My paternal grandmother was Emily Matilda Clarke, daughter of Maurice Clark who had
    married Sarah. He had many siblings including a brother William 1881-1967who married
    Sarah Lydia Griffiths 1880-1932. I was told of three daughters:
    Amanda Annie 1903-1997 Edith Doris 1906-1977 Matilda May 1908-2000

    A new found relative just sent me a photo of three young boys "Di, Ted and William".
    His mother had told him William and Sarah also had four boys "all of whom died young".
    I notice on the 1911 census that Sarah is not listed but it states 4 children born alive but then crossed out.

    Along with the photo I was given the following re the four boys:

    "Benjamin Edwin Llewelyn Clarke was born about 1901, and died about 1907, in between the 1901 census and the 1911 census.

    David (Di - probably a misspelling of Dai) was born about Jan 1912, don't know when he died, probably before 1939.

    William (B?) Clarke was born about Oct 1913 don't know when he died.

    Edward was born about 1915 and again probably died before 1939. "

    Reference to before 1939 being before the 1939 Register. I have the entry for that but notice from the
    Forum that I don't think it is possible to post that information? I guess I am allowed to say there are two
    entries but possibly the information re marital status has been reversed.

    Any input on this family would be very welcome and much appreciated.
    with thanks
    Jill

  2. #2
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    Some possibles:

    Benjamin Edwin Llewellyn CLARKE b. 1901 Neath mmn GRIFFITHS Q4 11A 858
    Died 1907 Neath aged 5. Q2 11A 436

    David Morris CLARKE b. 1912 Bridgend mmn GRIFFITHS Q1 11A 2016
    Died 1929 Bridgend aged 17. Q4 11A 812

    William Benjamin CLARKE b. 1913 Bridgend mmn GRIFFITHS Q4 11A 1913
    Died 1941 Bridgend aged 28. Q3 11A 895

    I can't see an Edward but there is this one:

    Edwin Arthur CLARKE b.1915 Bridgend mmn GRIFFITHS Q1 11A 2013

    Can't see a corresponding death but there is this one:

    Edward A CLARKE b. 1915 d. 1934 Neath aged 19. Q3 11A 744

    Peter

  3. #3
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    ELSINORE

    Dear Peter

    I can't thank you enough for the tremendous job you have done in finding the four Clarke boys.
    I am so grateful. I don't know how you found them and so quickly too - your work is very much appreciated.

    If it's not too impertinent of me to ask you/others, I'd like clarification of what can be disclosed from the 1939 Register
    - see my previous email. There are two entries one being the Father William but says married yet his wife had died.
    I have the name of the second entry but don't know if I can disclose the name but it says born 28.8.1914. Seemingly
    he died 1941 and it says Widowed - do you think these two marital status entries should be reversed?

    with thanks
    best wishes
    Jill

  4. #4
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    Jill, if you've looked at the entry in the 1939 Register yourself then you can disclose any details.

    What you can't do on the forum is ask for details to be revealed to you (i.e. a lookup). If for instance you've found in the index Freddie Bloggs aged 18 living in Streatham with Freda Bloggs and three more people you can't ask for information about them.

    Pam
    Vulcan XH558 - “Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.”

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilian rowland View Post
    I notice on the 1911 census that Sarah is not listed .
    It looks like Sarah was at her parents' home:

    1911 Census at 12 Albert Street, Aberavon
    David GRIFFITHS 66 night watchman Carmarthen
    Amanda Beatrice GRIFFITHS 62 Carmarthen
    Sarah Lydia CLARKE dau 30 Britton Ferry
    Edith May CLARKE* gdau 14 Aberavon
    plus two boarders

    *this is a transcription error. The original clearly states Edith May GRIFFITHS.

    Peter

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilian rowland View Post

    There are two entries one being the Father William but says married yet his wife had died.
    I have the name of the second entry but don't know if I can disclose the name but it says born 28.8.1914. Seemingly
    he died 1941 and it says Widowed - do you think these two marital status entries should be reversed?
    Thanks to Pam for clarifying the tricky situation around FMP's T & Cs (which I have fallen foul of in the past!).

    On the face of it, your supposition is right. However, that means there should be a marriage for William B Clarke:

    A William B CLARKE m. Tryphena E ROGERS 1937 Bridgend Q1 11A 1195
    Tryphena CLARKE d. 1939 Bridgend Q1 11A 867 (aged 22)

    making William B CLARKE a widower on the 1939 Register.

    Also William CLARKE, who's wife had died in 1932, could have remarried:

    A William CLARKE m. Gertrude E LOMAX 1937 Bridgend Q4 11A 1457
    Gertrude E CLARKE d. 1966 Cardiff Q1 8B 146 (aged 85)

    giving William the correct status on the 1939 Register.

    All supposition of course and, as with all the births and deaths in #2, can only be corroborated with certificates.

    Peter

  7. #7
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    PAM Thanks very much for clarifying the situation re the 1939 Register - much appreciated.

    ELSINORE

    Dear Peter

    Again thanks so much for the information in your posts Nos. 5 & 6.

    Re 5 and the info from the 1911 census for Griffiths - that's interesting as I have David Griffiths' death sometime in 1911.

    Re 6
    The 1939 Register, as you have guessed! from my previous posting, has
    "William Clarke born 9.1.1881 Married Butcher's shop man.
    William B Clarke born 28.8.1914 Widowed Butcher's shop keeper. "

    NB The possible birth you found for William B is 1913 Q4


    So good of you to have looked for a marriage for William B and indeed going the extra mile with possible second
    marriage for William Senior. A lot of information which is marvellous.

    Again, very many thanks.
    Best wshes
    Jill

  8. #8
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    ELSINORE
    PETER Out of courtesy I just wanted to update you and say that the information you provided re possible births
    and deaths etc has been invaluable and I am working on this now - so thanks so much! Has thrown up some interesting
    turn of events and one or two new found relatives!

    SOMEONE!

    Please would someone kindly advise about finding Death Notices/Inquest Report and Probate as I have three Clarke sons
    I'd like to find info about their deaths. All died young so since I can't remember what Probate is exactly - does someone
    have to have made a Will for Probate to be carried out? I know that Probate is the administration of someone's Estate
    ie would there be Probate for these three young people who can't have made a Will since they died in accidents.

    I have tried looking for newspaper articles welshnewspapersonline but despite using Advanced Search still come up with
    thousands so have had to give that up.

    1) EDWARD CLARKE being one Elsinore found. Seemingly Birth in name Edwin Arthur but death is in name EDWARD
    died 1.8.1934 Fall of roof at Pentre Colliery. Inquest 3.8.1934. I was sent a Death Notice which refers to a wife but have
    no details of her but since he died age 19 must be within narrow frame.

    Then back a generation
    2) Brinley Lewis Clarke born 1896 died age 19 Q3 1915 Neath road accident.

    3) Frederick Clarke born 1858 died February 1870 age 12 Bedwellty Monmouthshire

    with thanks
    Jill

  9. #9
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    Hi Jill,

    I think your first action should be to obtain a copy of the death certificate for each of them.

    If an inquest was required to ascertain cause of death, a death certificate would only be issued after the coroner's decision and, therefore, show the cause and date of death. That may be an oversimplification but, if so, perhaps somebody will put me right.

    You can order pdf copies of the death certificates from the GRO at a cost of £6 each.

    Note that Brinley Lewis CLARKE's death appears on the GRO as Brimley CLARKE.

    The added advantage of a death certificate for Edward Arthur CLARKE is that it may help to prove he is the same person as Edwin Arthur CLARKE.

    There are some members on BritGen who are very good at winkling out information from newspapers, etc., and I'm sure they'll be along to assist you.

    Peter

  10. #10
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    ELSINORE

    Dear Peter

    Thanks again for your words of wisdom!

    With regard to the first person I referred to in my last posting ie:

    "1) EDWARD CLARKE being one Elsinore found. Seemingly Birth in name Edwin Arthur but death is in name EDWARD
    died 1.8.1934 Fall of roof at Pentre Colliery. Inquest 3.8.1934. I was sent a Death Notice which refers to a wife but have
    no details of her but since he died age 19 must be within narrow frame."

    I do in fact have his Death cert having just been sent that from a new found relative plus two others making three out of the four
    sons . That's where I got the actual date of death and date of Inquest. It's in the name of Edward Arthur but in fact there's no way
    of telling if the right person other than my being sent it by someone connected to the family.

    I won't bother with the Death certs for the other two I refer to. I am just curious to read about the accidents - sounds morbid!

    For your interest. You recall with the entries in the 1939 Register for William and his son William Benjamin that at first I thought
    the marital status entries were reversed. You gave a possible marriage for each of them The possible marriage for the son is
    right, but for the Father has thrown up a mystery which hopefully will soon be solved!.

    Yes if someone can find info relating to these last few postings ie Probate and newspaper reports that would also be helpful
    with thanks
    Best wishes
    Jill

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