Isaacs Asher/Hyam/Benjamin = Charles Sinclair

[phillip]

Ellen and Denise
What do you make of these record with specific reference to the surname, trade and address:
UK Register of Apprentice Indentures
HYAM ASHER Glass cutter Spitalfields Apprentice Benjamin Cohen Tues 29 July 1800

HYAM ASHER -KAITE COURT Spitalfields Glass cutter- apprentice Gabriel Barnet Tues 19 August 1800

Are these 2 Hyam Asher one in the same and in particular are they Hyam ISAACS or are they different people?

If they are Hyam Isaacs why was he calling himself Hyam Asher in 1800?

The Kaite Court address ( again I take it to be Keat Court) seems to be a very close coincidence coupled with the same first name and trade as Hyam Isaacs.

Is Hyam changing his last name and putting a distance between himself and his father/siblings given he was already an apostate by 1794 ( I think this was the date for one of his early publications)? Is this why he went to Devon but if so, why would he use Asher and then Isaacs for his last names?

He was clearly known as Hyam Isaacs from his publications and preachings-
Jewish Chronicle Archives Sept 1 1842

"Buy my book" we have been informed by a lady, that she accidentally had the opportunity the other day of hearing an apostate Jew named, HYAM ISAACS, hold forth to an admiring ( proh pudor!) multitude. After giving an account of his life, adventures and conversion, this worthy told his audience that Jews are not allowed to read several chapters in Isaiah, Daniel etc....the preacher concluded by a significant invitation to "buy his book". How like the mountebank system of recommending the virtue of his nostrum......"

Your thoughts on the Hyam ASHER Keat Court Glass cutter and Hyam ISAACS glass cutter and apostate preacher welcome.

Phillip

[phillip]

Denise
Ellen has quite rightly pointed out in a private e mail that the Apprentice Indentures were legal documents and raised the question why would Hyam Asher call himself Hyam Isaacs if they were one in the same.

Phillip

[denione]

Hi Philip (and Ellen), thanks for these further valuable insights. I have written to Synagogue Scribes as you suggested to see if they can shed light on the marriage record / surname reference and any other references they may have to Asher Aryeh Lemon-man [Hebrew name]. With your knowledge of Jewish genealogy would this be an indicator of his origin's e.g. Aryeh in Persia [where it was once a source of citrus fruit]?

On the Hyam Asher and Hyam Isaacs, again I wonder if Hyam's conversion to Christianity was difficult for his father who was listed on Machzor 1807 as member of congregation? Could Hyam have been encouraged to drop his Asher surname and revert to b. Isaacs? I think you mentioned Asher b. Isaacs could have been Asher's father? This is a common behaviour given our Benjamin Isaacs clearly added Sinclair to all his children (middle name) and they all later dropped Isaacs - perhaps as it was a temporary change by Hyam. Supposition I know.

I will post again if/when I hear from Synagogue Scribes.

All your inputs have been very insightful. Thank you.

[phillip]

Hi Denise
I too wrote to Angela and let us see what she says. The issue revolves around Hyam Asher and Hyam I saacs being one in the same. If Hyam had changed his name from Asher to Isaacs which last name did his father have in 1807? If it was Asher then we need proof that Hyam Isaacs as per his 1814 Baptism where he calls his father Asher Isaacs fruit dealer is Hyam Asher with a change of last name.

This is a puzzle.

Phillip

[phillip]

Denise
In #9 Ellen referred to Moses Isaacs son of Hyam who was transported for 7 years following his trial at Devon Assizes in 1839 and death in Tasmania 31 July 1842.
I would have liked to have seen the original records in which he talks about his father Hyam, mother Lavinia and brother George who he refers to as a shopkeeper. Moses had a previous conviction.

The name Lavinia is an interesting one for Moses mother given she was Amelia in the 1841 census but I noted also that the daughter of Chapman Isaacs was also Lavinia in the 1841 census at Palmer Street Spitalfields - see previous posts which record the census data.
Of equal interest is the reference in the Tasmanian Convict records that Moses was recorded as coming from Poland.

There maybe errors in the recording of the facts regarding Moses however the current data may raise questions about the origins of Hyam Isaacs or at least his father.

It is not common practice for Ashkenazi Jews to name their children after living descendants. If Lavinia was the mother of Moses did she die and Hyam re-married hence Chapman Isaacs naming his daughter Lavinia born circa 1818 after his dead mother?

This family raises more questions than answers but they are an intriguing line.

Phillip

[CliveHenly]

I have just come across this thread, and I think there could be a connection with my Woolf family who lived in Exeter. My earliest known ancestor was Isaac Woolf, born around 1774. We believe he came from Poland or Germany, and immigrated around 1790 - 1800. He married a lady called Leah, who came from Bideford, and they had a large family between 1810 and 1830, including my ancestor, Michael Woolf (1825-1902). We believe he was linked (possibly a brother) to Marcus Woolf (1780-1860) who (according to the 1851 census) came from Prussia. Interestingly, in one of the censuses, Marcus called himself "Woolf Woolf", which demonstrates the interchangeability of names in the Jewish culture.
We have found several links between the Woolf families in Exeter and London, and recent DNA tests have demonstrated this to be the case. This includes a link with a Benjamin Woolf (possibly the father of your Amelia) who was an actor.

[SusanLorraine]

My great-great grandfather was James Isaacs and I've seen a copy of his marriage certificate (married in a church) in which his father is described as Hyam Isaacs, Greengrocer. He had a sister called Elizabeth and she was also married in a church, her father Hyam Isaacs, again, listed as a Greengrocer. My family, who are all descended from Hyam Isaacs are all Christian, so it seems they really did convert to Christianity. More confusing is that in later copies of the census, James and Elizabeth Isaacs are registered as living with their mother, Mary Isaacs, although I can find no further trace of a Mary Isaacs. I also have a copy of a marriage certificate of a daughter of Hyam Isaacs called Rosetta Isaacs who was married in the same church as her brother and sister and her father is also Hyam Isaacs, greengrocer. She was born in the year before James Isaacs but was not registered as living with them and Mary Isaacs in the census. It leads me to believe one of two things... either there was more than one Hyam Isaacs living in that area, or Hyam Isaacs was carrying on with more than one woman! "My" Hyam Isaacs is presumably the one who converted to Christianity along with his parents Asher and Betsey and his siblings. Asher Isaacs is registered as a "fruit dealer" and "lemon dealer" so I guess Hyam went to work with his father. It's all a bit of a tangle, especially as I've not found my great-great grandfather James in anyone else's famiy trees,although Hyam Isaacs apparently had quite a lot of children.If anyone can throw any further clarification on this I'd be very grateful!

[almach]

Hi SusanLorraine and welcome to the Brit-Gen forums.

I saw your request yesterday but left it as there are members far more knowledgeable than me on Jewish research. However, as no-one has responded yet I decided to take a further look and see if I was able to help even in a small way.

You say James and Elizabeth were with their Mother, Mary, on a census return. The only census I see where those three names are living together is in 1841 - Mary 55yrs not born in Middlesex, Elizabeth 10 or 18 (unclear) and James 15 both born Middlesex, Piece 679; Book 8; Folio 41; Page number 20. The 1841 census doesn't give relationships so there's no proof Mary was the Mother of James and Elizabeth,

A Betsey Isaacs was married 27th Aug 1843, her father Hyram a grocer. She married Charles Stephens, a witness was Sophia Isaacs.

July 25th 1862 Elizabeth Stevens a widow married Edward Marlyn (I think that's what is written) Elizabeth's father was Hyam Isaacs. Interestingly Frances Common(s) was a witness and a Henry Common(s) witnessed Betsey's marriage, I've found a Henry Commons and wife Frances on census returns, 1851 census ref: HO107; Piece: 1548; Folio: 494; Page: 37. Could Elizabeth and Betsey be the same person?

Henry and Frances Commons have a daughter, Sophia, who appears to marry Conrad Hoffman in 1867, her father deceased was a greengrocer, a witness to the marriage was Henry ISAACS.

12th Nov 1857: There's an order of removal for James Isaacs 32, his wife Sarah 29 and children James 10, Sarah 8, Henry 7, William 6, Sophia 4 and Samuel 12 months. Living at 8, White St, Portland Place. Married at Hackney 26th Nov 1849, son James was born before the marriage, states he was born in Rosemary Lane, I can't read the next bit, something about his father. States he has lived in the above house 8yrs and 2yrs in Whitechapel before. Has mother CATHERINE living in Shadwell he cannot say where, has a brother Hy living Hermitage? St, Wapping who confirms the birth.

As he names his Mother Catherine this maybe Hyram, Catherine, and some of their children in 1841. The Ancestry copy is unclear, I found it on The Genealogist site.

Russell Court, Whitechapel, which is next to Shadwell. HO107/0716/F?
Hyam Isaacs 70, dealer, Catherine 50, Betsy 18, Rose 16, Isaac 16, Elizabeth 8.

1851 census has Catherine Isaacs 63, widow Greengrocer, born City of London, living 1, Russell Court.

I have to leave it for now and hope it has helped and not caused more confusion!

[almach]

has a brother Hy living Hermitage? St,

1861, 8,Gt,Hermitage St. RG 9; Piece: 281; Folio: 182; Page: 10;
Henry Isaacs 49, greengrocer, St Georges, Middlesex.
Ann Elizabeth Isaacs 35, St Georges
Henry Isaacs 8, St Georges
Catherine McCarthy 15, servant
Joseph Frankert 15, servant

St Matthias, Bethnal Green. Frances Elizabeth Lydia born Nov 2nd 1863, baptised Jan 3rd 1864, dau of Ann Elizabeth and Henry Isaacs a greengrocer of 8, Gt Hermitage St.

[almach]

St Ann Church Westminster, March 21st 1859.
Henry Isaacs 44, bachelor, greengrocer, 45, Crown St, father Hyam a fishmonger.
Ann Elizabeth Peach 34, spinster, 40, Gerrard St, father James
Witnesses Henry and Frances Common (those names again, they must have been close to the Isaacs family)