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  1. #11

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    Hi Christina

    That's very interesting, thank you! This Mary's age fits, and the type of work she is doing. But I wonder why she put Allington as her birth place? Usually entries for the Chapmanslade area are entered as either Chapmanslade, Corsley or Westbury.

    But this one is a possibility.

    Thank you very much! If you come across any other Mary Tanners in the 1861 census that are a closer fit, I'd love to hear!
    Thanks again for your help. It's very exciting to fill out the picture!

  2. #12
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    There is more than one Allington in Wiltshire. The one near Chippenham is unlikely as communication lines don't run in a supportive manner. The other is near Amesbury, across Salisbury Plain which is something of a barrier to travel. I'm not sure this is your Mary Tanner in Hinton. pwholt

  3. #13

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    That's interesting too, thanks pwholt. I'm not convinced this is my Mary Tanner either, but if not, where is she in 1861? She would have been 20 years old, so she may have left the county by then. I think for the time being, the search continues...

  4. #14
    Name well known on Brit-Gen
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    So easy when you think out of the box....last ditch attempt to use * anner. The place of birth was not being picked up in the filters

    1861
    Mary Sanner 1841 Chapmanslade, Wiltshire, England Servant Warminster, Wiltshire

    RG 9; Piece: 1304; Folio: 37; Page: 29;
    Market Place Warminster
    Household
    George Dodman 62
    Eliza Painter 29
    Henry Spackman 19
    Mary Sanner 20

    Did Mary meet William in the area, you will need to check his Army record to find when he was in the UK

  5. #15

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    Oh, wow! Fantastic! Thanks so much!! I'm thrilled with that information. Sherlock Holmes couldn't have done better.
    So sometime between 1861 in Warminster and 1871 in Penge, Mary met William Morris, a sapper who rose to second corporal in the Royal Engineers.

    Off to check his Army record...

    Thanks again!

  6. #16
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Great work geneius - again!

    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  7. #17
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    Ironically, in more recent time, the base of the Royal Engineers (or at least REME) has been... Warminster! pwholt

  8. #18

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    Ah! That's neat. Thanks!

  9. #19
    A fountain of knowledge
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    Penge, London, England
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    As expected, Mary's employer, William Ellis, is shown at The Oaks, Cintra Park, in French's Penge Directory 0f 1871, and is still there in Kelly's 1874 Directory of Surrey. This suggests she didn't emigrate with her employer, but directories aren't always up to date, or he may have kept the house on. He isn't anywhere in Penge in French's 1876 Directory.

    Going back in time, he isn't in the 1867 Post office Directory of Surrey, but next door, at Cintra Villa, is "Hands, Mrs Colonel", presumably the Agnes Hands, widow, aged 57, in the 1871 census, and maybe the Agnes for whom there is an Indian Army pension record showing her born 1811, died 24-Feb-1872. I haven't been able to trace her husband and leave this to the military experts. Pure conjecture: he was also in the R.E., William was his batman, and she married the boy next door.

    A few local notes for anyone trying to follow this up: Cintra Villa was not the same as the big posh Cintra House off Church Road; Cintra Park changed its name from Talavera Road around 1870; and because the postal areas don't follow municipal boundaries, it will probably be given as (Upper) Norwood rather than Penge or Anerley.

    The above houses in Cintra Park are probably still there, but translating names to present-day numbers will take a bit more detective work.

  10. #20

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    Thanks Chris, that's absolutely fascinating. I didn't know about French's Penge Directory of 1871 and I can't find it by googling it. Is it available to view online?
    I know Mary Tanner was working in Warminster as a house servant to a linen draper in 1861, and I've also discovered that the linen draper ceased trading in 1867, so I'd rather assumed (but without evidence) that she went directly from Warminster to Penge in 1867. However, if William Ellis isn't listed as being in Cintra Park in 1867 she must have had another job (or jobs) between 1867 (or earlier) and 1871.
    How ingenious to think of looking up who was living next door! I'll try and find out a bit more about Colonel Hands and his army career - although I don't think William Morris was ever in India. His army record lists North America, Gibraltar, Malta and Bermuda.
    The Post Office Directory is another very valuable lead - thank you for that, too. I'd love to find out which number The Oaks became. Maybe the name The Oaks is inscribed over the door...
    Anyway, all fascinating and very helpful. Thank you.

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