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  1. #11

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    Steve I dont know, because I dont have a marriage certificate or in fact any certificate pertaining to her. Her death certificate In South Africa is appently somewhere online, but I cant find it. her date on death on Ancestry.com however agrees with the gravestone date pictured. Will a death certificate list her place of birth? The information that exisits on Ancestry lists only her name and her place of birth as Dublin Ireland (much research was done on this a book of my grandfathers family was published, so Im sure the info is correct. The date nof birth however Was wron. her date if death is accurate. The ancestry enty is pictured above too. Thanks.

  2. #12
    Knowledgeable and helpful stepives's Avatar
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    I've looked at a few of those trees, and there appears to be no documentation. Do not use other peoples trees as fact, unless there is a paper trial of actual documentation. Contact the tree owners, and see what they have to say.

    If it's not verified on a paper document, it didn't happen.

    If her date of birth was wrong, that is a big mistake. So there could well be other errors. Some of it may be family folk lore, and assumed as fact. It may well all be correct, with just that one error.

    I've no idea how to get certs from South Africa, maybe you should post in another forum, for South Africa.
    Too many bones, too much sorrow, but until I am dead, there's always tomorrow.

  3. #13
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    There is a submitted family tree on familysearch.org which has Frances, her husbands and children on it but no date or place of birth for her. https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/2:2:3Z4N-X8T

    Her death certificate is also on familysearch.org Here

    The reference to her birth as Dublin 1863 shows up in a google search as being in a private tree on ancestry and is obviously wrong on the birthdate so as Steve says can be wrong on birth place.
    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  4. #14
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    On the death certificate, her birthplace is given as Cape Province.

    In 1901 Irish census, the only Devilliers in Dublin is an Isaac, a 19 yr old medical student from South Africa. Religion, dutch reform.
    Last edited by Mona; 01-10-2016 at 8:47 PM. Reason: Addition

  5. #15
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    On the 1901 England and Wales census RG13 Piece 1493 Folio 39 Page 27there is a Frances L De Villiers born 1883 orange State Cape Town with her parents Melius born Saxony (Kingdom State), Craugs Free and Adelaide born Ireland. All the children born Orange Free State. But the middle initial for Frances is wrong and the age is 10 years out.
    I can't see them in the 1911 UK census.


    NO you can forget her, her baptism is on family search.org with a middle name of Lilian and she may be the one who's form of registration of a death is on familysearch.org in 1902

    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  6. #16

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    Thanks Christina,
    I was hoping a death certificate might list her place of birth, apparently not, record keeping in the 1900s seems to have been very lax. I have the same problem with my maternal grandmothers birth in Sussex, all eight brothers and sisters recorded well, but hers not. Pretty much there are holes in lots of things. Im reasonably certain she was born in Dublin, its a strange choice to pick it out of a hat.. when there are many England births in the Jackson line and in South Africa.
    If she was born in South Africa it would be stated and most certainly I could find her birth records. It is possible she was adopted, Im not ruling that out. That may well be why she retained the name Thompson in her name and Devilliers.. which she passed on to my father. and it formed his middle name officially.
    Could anyone help me with how to search adoption records in Ireland. Or could someone with more skill than me search for Frances Thompson born in Ireland. in 1894.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by belladonnas View Post
    I was hoping a death certificate might list her place of birth, ....
    It DOES state her place of birth. Look at the image, not just the short transcript, on family search. Item 6: Birthplace. Cape Province.

  8. #18

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    thanks Mona, I saw that, it seems to be a possible assumption. The Cape province is thousands of square kilometres incompasing hundreds of cities, It would be like stating you were born in England, without the birthplace? and why would the birthdate be an estimate date on such an important document as a death certificate, why is there no birth certificate for her in South Africa. when on that same family tree the birth certificates and marriage certificates in South Africa with an exact place of birth, date back to 1700s ? Its possible, but strange that no birth record exsists for her in South Africa.

  9. #19
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    Civil registration for births did not begin in Cape Province until 1895. The document states her age, it does not ask for date of birth. This is sure looking for a needle in a haystack of baptisms!

  10. #20
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    I was doing a bit of searching and came across this book in google books. Unfortunately not available as an e -book.
    The Jacksons of Nelspoort, Cape of Good Hope, and their descendants
    This was the snippet that came up in the search.


    So who was Thompson Joost and why did the author think he was related to Frances?
    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

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