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Thread: Clare(Cheshire)/Kirk(Derbyshire)
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28-07-2016, 2:27 PM #11bettyespanaGuest
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28-07-2016, 2:32 PM #12janboothGuest
Betty,
Given that your James CLARE named his first son Peter and that James was married in Grappenhall, have you considered a baptism at Grappenhall on 12 December 1790 of a James son of Peter CLARE, Blacksmith? Unless of course you know definitely that his father was a Joseph and he was born c1796.
Janet
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28-07-2016, 2:54 PM #13bettyespanaGuest
Now you have got me going Janet because I really don't know!Can this one be tied up with Philip GeoffreyClare his other son & the other female children named previously.
I have just been looking at Philips marriage cert to see if I could see anything that might give an extra clue i.e.witnesses but I don't think they help.The witness names were Joseph McCabe & mark of Isabella Hudson.
Also meant to say earlier have you noticed the age difference in the ages of James & Alice? James I have 1795 & Alice c.1776.
I think that age for Alice was worked out from the censuses.By the time she had Philip she would have been 50yrs of age!Not impossible but I would think highly improbable.
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28-07-2016, 11:32 PM #14
- Join Date
- May 2010
- Location
- Cheshire UK
- Posts
- 4,863
Too late to digest the body of this query however I know ( my late parents lived that way and I was asked to go 'rummagining' for CLARE ) there were CLARE's around Appleton / Stretton/Stockton Heath area. not too far from Grappenhall, however the researcher has since died and I do not know what happened to her research papers. Maybe North Ches Family History will know as Joan was their President.
This may help https://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.co...-02/1046460613
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29-07-2016, 6:44 AM #15bettyespanaGuest
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29-07-2016, 10:07 AM #16janboothGuest
I think the addresses given on the marriage records I have found all seem to tie in with the two census records, i.e. either Parker Street or 60 Chester Street. I have also found in both my own and other research that a lot of woman were still having children into their 50's, so maybe not so improbable. Unfortunately, because we have no census records or death record for James CLARE, we really have no idea when or where he was born, because his marriage record in 1817 gives us no clue except they were both supposedly of the parish. At first glance the witnesses on the marriage record do not appear to be of much help either. Looking at the census records, there is a family of THORNTONs in the 1841 census of Latchford, so presumably Samuel THORNTON, one of the witnesses, was living in Latchford at the time of the marriage of James & Alice.
I am not sure that the death in 1852 is your James CLARE. Looking on the census records for a James CLARE living in Manchester in the 1851 does not bring up anyone with a birth date old enough to be married in 1817. The only way to totally eliminate him would be to purchase the death certificate.
Not much help again, but will keep looking.
Janet
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29-07-2016, 10:41 AM #17janboothGuest
Bit more background information on Eliza CLARE:
1851 census of Hulme, Mancester:
William H LIGHTFOOT Head Mar 30 Warehouseman in Corn Warehouse Yorkshire Halifax
Eliza do Wife Mar 33 Cheshire High Leigh
William H do Son 3 Lancashire Hulme
Thomas do Son 1 do do
Sarah Ann CLARE Stepdaughter 13 Cotton Power Loom Weaver do do
Jane do do 10 do do
Eliza is a widow by the 1891 census of Stretford.
No sign of mother Alice living with her at any time after her marriage.
And of Peter CLARE & wife Sarah:
Born 27 Sep, bap 7 Dec 1851 James son of Peter & Sarah CLARE, Manchester, Mechanic
Born 7 Dec 1854, bap 25 Feb 1855 Amelia daughter of Peter & Sarah CLARE, Manchester, Mechanic
Born 24 Feb, bap 13 Dec 1857 Joseph son of Peter & Sarah CLARE, Manchester, Mechanic
All at Manchester Cathedral
Peter CLEARE & wife Sarah plus children are in the 1871 census of Chorlton on Medlock (RG10/3992, folio 48, page 45) and by the 1881 census of Hulme Sarah is shown as a widow.
Still no definite sighting of Alice CLARE after the 1851 census.
Janet
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29-07-2016, 11:32 AM #18janboothGuest
Daughter Susannah CLARE is living in Ancoats Manchester in the 1861 census (RG9/2930, folio 17, page 27) described as an unmarried Calico Weaver living at 23 Ward Street with daughter Susannah, aged 15 born Manchester.
The reason I am trying to find Alice in any census records subsequent to the 1851, is that I have found a burial at Hulme St George of an Alice CLARE on 16 April 1854 (died 12 April of Natural Decay), aged 65, but she is shown as of Lymm. However, I cannot find an Alice CLARE living in Lymm in either the 1841/51 census. Have you found the death record of your Alice, Betty?
Janet
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29-07-2016, 12:41 PM #19bettyespanaGuest
Unfortunately I never found very much info for Alice so no I have not got a death record for her.I don't even have any idea who her parents were.The Hulme area of Manchester was also a registration district & I have an idea that Parker Street & Chester street may have been in the Hulme registration district.So it may be that the burial you have found is the Alice we are looking for.
Betty
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29-07-2016, 1:27 PM #20bettyespanaGuest
Hi Janet,
Just looking on F.S & found another Alice Clare in deaths & there is this one JAS qtr 1858 Reg.Chorlton 8C 334 17
Chorlton is also Manchester & near to the Hulme area.
I also looked up St Georges Hulme on Lancs Parish Reg & there are quite a few of births only listed for Clares but burials not listed.
Betty
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