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  1. #1
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    Default JOHN JAMES HARPER

    Good day

    I have tried most things to get to the ancestors of John James HARPER, as mentioned above. All that I have about him is certain facts:
    He was born roundabout 1834 and married 1 Aug 1870 at age 36 Maria Elizabeth GräBE in South Africa. The family remained here and Maria Elizabeth was a South African. They had a daughter Sarah Maria HARPER. I did find the marriage record. No death certificate could be found here in South Africa for either John James or Maria Elizabeth.

    John James was my grandmother’s grandfather and the story goes:
    John James and a friend played at a harbour somewhere in Ireland. A childless captain of a South African ship asked them if they wanted to see his ship. They did and a few weeks later it docked in Cape Town South Africa. He was apparently 11 to 13 years old when it happened. He insisted to keep his surname.
    Can anyone help me to find his parents?

    Regards

    Barry

  2. #2
    Valued member of Brit-Gen MrsPoppy's Avatar
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    Default

    Hi Barry

    Have you seen the posting on Rootsweb regarding South Africa orange free state founding fathers - It has his name as John Jones Harper but that could be a transcript error.

    Not sure if I am allowed to put a link to it from here.

    It has Kry geen sterfkennisse next to John and Maria's names and when I googled a translation of that it came up with 'no death notices'

    Mrs P

  3. #3
    Valued member of Brit-Gen MrsPoppy's Avatar
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    Default

    Having seen the marriage certificate on family search, it does say John James but I cannot make out his occupation. There is a reference on NAAIRS - Depot NAB, Reference 11/456. John James Harper 1901. Is this a deceased estate file? there are people on here who have knowledge of NAAIRS so someone may be able to explain what that file is likely to be and if it is likely to be a death.

    Is it the daughter who is in Wales in 1891 and 1901 and in Somerset in 1911 as a servant? Did the daughter just turn up back in England but no sign of the parents?.

    Mrs P

  4. #4
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Default

    Welcome to the Brit-Gen forums Barry

    I find the Naair's site a bit confusing to use but did find this and wonder if this young girl belongs with your family?

    Pietersburg Concentration Camp, Pietersburg District, Northern Province.
    Elizabeth Maria Harper of Geen vaste adres.
    Died 24-08-1901.
    Aged 14 years and 6 months.


    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  5. #5
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Default

    I did find the marriage record
    Do you mean you have the marriage certificate?

    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  6. #6
    Valued member of Brit-Gen MrsPoppy's Avatar
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    Default

    Hi Christina - the marriage certificate is viewable on family search as is the daughter's christening. Orange free state records then Winberg, the daughter's christening is in 1871 and she is christened as Susan Marin Martha with 4 sponsors.

    Good find on the concentration camp angle - there is also a Mrs Maria Elizabeth HARPUR (sic) wiith daughter of same name in the BCCD web site. Aged 54, a widow - not died in camp.

    I see Miss Elizabeth Maria Harper who died aged 14 is the stepdaughter of Mr Jacob Adrian Herpst.

  7. #7
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    Default

    I agree the John Jones is a transcript error. Yes I have seen the entry thanks

  8. #8
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    Default

    It can not be the 14 year old girl

  9. #9
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    Default

    Mrs Poppy and christanel, thanks for your replies so far

  10. #10
    Valued member of Brit-Gen MrsPoppy's Avatar
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    Hi Barry

    I don't know what information South African death records have, (if you can get one, plenty of discussions and information on the boards about that though) I wondered if we could find a death for John James would it give his parents names or at least confirm his country of origin.

    Mrs P

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