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  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by christanel View Post
    It's early in the morning and you have lost me with this one Wayne.

    Are you saying that Daniel Joseph Bruyn born 1805 Roscommon Ireland was actually a Joseph Nicholls who married a Sarah Nicholls in England, then before leaving England he changed his name to Bruyn and was named on the ship's manifest as Bruyn?

    The children of Daniel and Sarah were registered as Bruyn


    Births Dec 1/4 1839
    Ellen Bruyn Kings Norton 18/382

    Births Dec 1/4 1841
    Elizabeth Ann Bruyn Kings Norton 18/392

    Births Mar 1/4 1850
    Sarah Malvina Bruyn Kings Norton 18/425

    I'll wait for you to get back to me to do any more.

    Christina
    No Christine, Joseph Nicholls the son of Sarah Nicholls before she married Daniel Joseph Bruyn. All records in England and even the ship records for the Daphne have him as Joseph Nicholls (the entry says Joseph Nicholls and family).

    Esther and Ellen are the same person.

  2. #12
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    link to the entry didn't work so here is the info

    NICHOLLS Joseph aged 22 and family arrived on the Daphne in 1859 - Sydney and/or Newcastle -
    Reel 2138, [4/4795]

    him, his wife and 2 children were then named Bruyn and Joseph is the only one to carry on the "Bruyn" name but he is actually Joseph Nicholls.

  3. #13
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    Christine,

    Daniel and Sarah also had

    Mary Bruyn - She was born at three o'clock in the morning of Thursday 15th May 1845 and died on Saturday 19th September 1846 at three o'clock in the afternoon, aged one year and four months. Both events happened rue Catinat, in the district of Trigauville, in Graville, where Daniel Justin was born in 1847. There is no cause of death given.

    It is the French Records that record both Daniel and Sarah's middle names (the only time I have seen them anywhere).

    Augustin (Austin on his dad's death certificate) Bruyn - birth registration for an Agustin (sic) Bruyn in King's Norton R.D. in the first quarter of 1854 (vol 6c, page 439) and a death registration for Augustin Bru_N in King's Norton R.D. in the last quarter of 1854 (vol 6c, page 282).

    Kind Regards,

    Wayne

  4. #14
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    The eldest children Joseph before the marriage and Margaret after the marriage were both born in Birmingham, Warwickshire

  5. #15
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    Ah now I am with you.

    So any descendant of Joseph Bruyn is a Nicholls and are probably having difficulty taking their paternal line further back, whereas the descendants of the daughters of Daniel and Sarah are Bruyns but don't bear that name and are also having difficulty taking their paternal line back because we can't link Daniel to his parents who he gives as Edward and Margaret on the shipping record.

    Christanel
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
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  6. #16
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    Christina yes that is it but with the birth of Joseph Nicholls 1834 in Birmingham it says father Joseph Nicholls mum Sarah Nicholls. Sarah Nicholls (his mum), her dad is Joseph Nicholls so I think it ends there on his dad's side but the Bruyn's atleast have Edward and Margaret as a lead.

  7. #17
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    Daniel and Sarah may have married in Warwickshire as both Joseph Nicholls (1834) before the marriage and Margaret Bruyn (1837) after the marriage were christened at Aston Juxta, Birmingham Warwickshire.

  8. #18
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Cook View Post
    The eldest children Joseph before the marriage and Margaret after the marriage were both born in Birmingham, Warwickshire
    Their births, or at least Margaret's, was registered in the Birmingham Warwickshire registration district but the 1841 census has Daniel born Ireland, with Sarah, Joseph, Margaret and Esther all born in Staffordshire county. Smethwick is very close to Birmingham.

    I know it sounds a bit pedantic but it can hinder/help in searches.

    I am still trying to find a marriage- without any luck - so I am obviously not doing something right, unless they never married. We have names for both sets of parents for Sarah nee Nicholls and Daniel Bruyn but nothing definite to join them up.

    Christina
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  9. #19
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    Yeah looks like I've hit some brick walls as I can't find his birth or even his parents marriage. At times I hate Irish genealogy. My direct line of Cook goes back to Benjamin Cooke (the e was dropped when he came to Australia) a convict from Dublin and the trail ends there and previous people who have tried, were told the records were destroyed in a fire.

  10. #20
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    Hi, I haven't been in here for ages but I now have a lead to look in France as in an obit I found for Ellen Bruyn in Dungog it has she lived in France for 4 years with her people who were a long established French Family

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