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  1. #21
    jules67
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    The 1881 one is the one i have....
    Id be greatful if u could point me in the direction of the 1871 ones Megan...im struggling! x

  2. #22
    jules67
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    Just to throw another spanner in the works folks...another thing to think about. When he married Alice Kenworthy in Dobcross, he is recorded as a widower......so he had been wed before! But was that still at home in Wales.....or elsewhere? x

  3. #23
    Brick wall demolition expert!
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    1871
    Marchweil, Denbighshire - Wrexham district (suspect the place name is an Ancestry mangle, but have not looked at the original)
    Daniel, wife Ann, various children including William aged 11, supposedly born Marchweil.
    Ref: Piece: 5651; Folio: 195; Page: 9
    I doubt that this is your family.

    Whitford, Flintshire
    The William here is 14, so I think probably far too old to be yours.
    Parents Daniel and Mary.
    Ref: Piece: 5638; Folio: 35; Page: 1

    When you look at all of this again, look at my earlier suggestion about the birth certificate and the search for one where the father is Daniel.

  4. #24
    Mutley
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    Quote Originally Posted by jules67 View Post
    The 1881 one is the one i have....
    Id be greatful if u could point me in the direction of the 1871 ones Megan...im struggling! x
    Me too

    Seeing as David Edward was stated as born St. Asaph I had a look at birth registrations on Free BMD.
    Births Registrations in St. Asaph between March 1855 and December 1875
    David Edward Davies, Jun 1871
    David Edwards WILLIAMS, Jun 1872
    David Edward Jones, Sep 1875

    If the Williams one is yours, it would also mean that David's birth dates were as wrong as your William's (9 in 1881 not 17). Would also explain why he is not in the 1871 census and sounds like he is the son of Ann. You could apply for the certificate requesting that Ann is the mother and it would not cost you anything if that is not correct.

  5. #25
    jules67
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    Thanks again Megan. The only one that seems viable is the Rhuddlan one. To be honest, even if i buy the birth certificate its not going to tell me for sure its my William Thomas! I dearly hope it is.....but like i say, i need to make the connection with this boy to the info i have of him as an adult and i dont know how on earth i can do that xx

  6. #26
    jules67
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    I have just found a William Roberts aged 27 on the census of 1901...still living in Rhyl. Its literally around the corner from his parents home. Says hes a bricklayer(?) Married to Mary with a son called Thomas?
    guess I'm looking for another marriage! lol

    its possible......

  7. #27
    Mutley
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    Also if you do think the 1881 we found is your William then it is worth looking at his siblings. There are possible registrations for the younger daughters and if they are yours then they will tell you Ann's maiden name and any previous married names she had.
    Births Dec 1876 Anne Roberts at St. Asaph
    Births Mar 1880 Jane Roberts at St. Asaph

    Good Luck with the marriage search - I must off to bed, let us know how you get on.

  8. #28
    jules67
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    ah...yes Mutley....thanks again Nite x

  9. #29
    jules67
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    I seem to of eliminated William, Mary and Thomas....they still seem to be in Rhyl in 1911, and I know for certain my William is in Abergle then.

  10. #30
    pippycat
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    Ive also been looking for your William Thomas Roberts - not a great deal of choice out there with a father Daniel.

    You'd like something definite, but unfortunately your not going to get any more than the records show.

    The known facts:

    William died Abergele 1931 - age 56
    He was a widower when he married Alice Kenworthy in 1905 - age 40
    He married Sarah Kenworthy 1915 - age 40
    His father: Daniel, a farm labourer.

    As William cannot have been age 40 for both marriages I imagine he took 10 years off his age when he wed Sarah Kenworthy. After that William had no choice but to stick with the lie.
    The headstone would only reflect the death information - hence age 56.


    Its probably nearer the truth William was born c1865 and really age 66 at death.
    - I think as it was his 3rd marriage and he's 30 years older than his wife (for that era he is 'getting on a bit') so of course he took 10 years off his age, he was old enough to be Sarah's father!!

    Your Ancestry tree shows Daniel married to Ann Williams - I assume thats come from "Daniel and Ann" on the census plus the St Asaph 1862 marriage entry?

    It might well be the correct couple, but until you find a birth record for William its only guesswork - its not safe to do that with a Roberts in Wales!

    I notice William and Sarah's son is a Daniel, wonder if they named their daughter Clara May after a family member too?


    Have you looked at Denbighshire County Council website?
    Under their 'Archive Service' you can eventually arrive at a list of personal names where its shows snippets of info - thats to assist you find records in their archives, but you may spot something there that jumps out at you!

    This is the type of thing it shows:

    There are only 2 Daniels listed under the Roberts surname:
    Daniel Roberts, Griffin Inn 1920, 1934.
    Daniel Roberts, Wrexham Regis, labourer, 1783.

    Under Roberts:
    Anne (formerly Jones) Henllan, 1781

    Under Roberts (otherwise Wright)
    Anne, Ruthin, Widow. 1790, 1803

    Have a look, there are lots of Roberts and Williams, you never know!

    Rebecca

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