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  1. #1
    InnesH
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    Default Caroline Louisa Carter' mother

    I am Caroline Louisa Holmes nee Carter's grandson.
    While I have been able to find out plenty about her father, my Great Grandfather, William Scott Carter and his wife, Amelia "commonly known as Emily" nee Browne, it does appear as though William Scott played around a bit, if one will forgive the use of today's expression!
    In the 1901 Irish Census there is the strange record of Bridget Mooney, Housekeeper, Roman Catholic, being quoted as "mother" to two boys, Francis Carter and Charles Carter, both Church of Ireland. The location is is Ballyfruit, Headford, Co: Galway, which adjoins William Scott Carter's property of Moyne Hill. The two boys were born in 1868 and 1873, respectively, and Caroline in 1874, so I have made the assumption that Bridget Mooney may well have been Caroline's birth mother.
    I would dearly love to know if this is so, and wonder if anybody can helpm me in my quest.
    Innes Hutchison

  2. #2
    Procat
    Guest

    Default

    Copied from Introduce Yourself section of forum.

  3. #3
    Coromandel
    Guest

    Default

    Hello Innes and welcome to the forum

    If we could find births or baptisms for Francis and Charles it might shed light on matters.

    I see from the 1901 census that Francis' birthplace is given as Dublin. I wonder if he is the Francis X. Carter who appears in the Illinois death index on FamilySearch:

    Francis X. Carter, died 14 Nov. 1940, Chicago aged 76; born 26 April 1864 Dublin, son of William S. Carter (b. Dublin) and Caroline (b. Ireland). Occupation 'Traffic Manager Pyle Nat.'; buried 16 Nov 1940, Rosehill Cemetery, Chicago.

    From his unusual middle initial he seems likely to be the Francis Xavier Carter in FamilySearch's 'Illinois Naturalization Index'; you can view the image of an index card which gives his d.o.b. as 28 April 1870 [six years later than in death index!], date of arrival in US as April 1902 and date of naturalization as 7 May 1925. His address was then 5046 Glenwood Ave.

    There's also an Illinois naturalization card for Charles Harcourt Carter (born 3 Sept 1874, arrived USA 10 May 1901, naturalized 23 July 1914). Address: 358 Garfield Avenue. Is this Francis' brother?

    I'd hoped that knowing the boys' full names might help to identify birth registrations . . . but no luck so far.

  4. #4
    Coromandel
    Guest

    Default

    This looks likely to be Charles crossing the Atlantic: Ancestry's 'Boston Passenger and Crew Lists, 1820-1943' has a 28 year old Charles H. Carter, single, clerk, arriving in September 1907 on the 'Cymric'; nationality English, race or people English (but these apparently written over 'Ireland' and 'Irish' respectively), last permanent residence Dublin, Ireland; name and address of nearest relative in country whence he came, father W.S. Carter, 13 Sto... Street, Dublin; final destination, New York, NY.

    One possibility for Francis is the 33 year old Francis Carter, clerk, on a list of cabin passengers on the 'Umbria', leaving Queenstown 15 July 1901; ticket no. 13055. So far I haven't spotted him arriving at the other end.

  5. #5
    Coromandel
    Guest

    Default

    There are six pages of army records for Francis Xavier Carter (born in Dublin about 1865) on Findmypast. You would need to have a subscription or to buy some credits to see the papers, but I think you will find it is worth it, as they give his next of kin (father, mother and two brothers).

  6. #6
    Mutley
    Guest

    Default

    There is a marriage for Caroline to John Henry Holmes in 1898 on Irish Genealogy
    https://
    churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/1c7db20565829

    Mother for both is N/R

  7. #7
    InnesH
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Procat View Post
    Copied from Introduce Yourself section of forum.
    Thanks,Procat...i see you live just down the highway from Geelong, where I live! Small world
    Innes

  8. #8
    InnesH
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mutley View Post
    There is a marriage for Caroline to John Henry Holmes in 1898 on Irish Genealogy
    https://
    churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/1c7db20565829

    Mother for both is N/R
    Thanks for this. I was aware of this particular record, and whilst I know the ancestry of my grandfather, john Henry Homes, my grandmother's mother is still a mystery...nil desperandum!
    Innes

  9. #9
    InnesH
    Guest

    Default Francis Xavier and Charles Harcourt Carter

    Hi and thanks for your help.
    Don't believe Francis Xavier fits the bill..somewhere I saw that his father was, I believe, a machinist. "My" William S Carter father was an Army Major, a title he used frequently, and specifically on the Marriage Certificate of his (illegitimate?) daughter Caroline Louisa to John Henry Holmes.
    Charles Harcourt sounds a lot more likely, as "Harcourt" was a name that was used by his grandfather, Samuel Charles Carter (of Mary Anne fame/infamy...a story in itself!) when naming two of his children viz. Robert Harcourt Carter and Harcourt Campbell Carter. Quite likely William Scott Carter would have used it when naming his own son. Now to prove it up, if possible!
    Regards
    Innes



    Quote Originally Posted by Coromandel View Post
    Hello Innes and welcome to the forum

    If we could find births or baptisms for Francis and Charles it might shed light on matters.

    I see from the 1901 census that Francis' birthplace is given as Dublin. I wonder if he is the Francis X. Carter who appears in the Illinois death index on FamilySearch:

    Francis X. Carter, died 14 Nov. 1940, Chicago aged 76; born 26 April 1864 Dublin, son of William S. Carter (b. Dublin) and Caroline (b. Ireland). Occupation 'Traffic Manager Pyle Nat.'; buried 16 Nov 1940, Rosehill Cemetery, Chicago.

    From his unusual middle initial he seems likely to be the Francis Xavier Carter in FamilySearch's 'Illinois Naturalization Index'; you can view the image of an index card which gives his d.o.b. as 28 April 1870 [six years later than in death index!], date of arrival in US as April 1902 and date of naturalization as 7 May 1925. His address was then 5046 Glenwood Ave.

    There's also an Illinois naturalization card for Charles Harcourt Carter (born 3 Sept 1874, arrived USA 10 May 1901, naturalized 23 July 1914). Address: 358 Garfield Avenue. Is this Francis' brother?

    I'd hoped that knowing the boys' full names might help to identify birth registrations . . . but no luck so far.

  10. #10
    InnesH
    Guest

    Default

    Certainly, the record for Charles Harcourt Carter looks right. Ancestry says his birthplace was Headford, which is correct, and his father William Scott Carter was also from there, dying there in 1900. However the entry does vary from your other post of 13 Oct, where Charles's arrival was stated to be 1901. I guess these sorts of errors are fairly commonplace, particularly when they are made years later?
    Thanks and best regards
    Innes...still trying to trace my grandmother's mother!
    Quote Originally Posted by Coromandel View Post
    This looks likely to be Charles crossing the Atlantic: Ancestry's 'Boston Passenger and Crew Lists, 1820-1943' has a 28 year old Charles H. Carter, single, clerk, arriving in September 1907 on the 'Cymric'; nationality English, race or people English (but these apparently written over 'Ireland' and 'Irish' respectively), last permanent residence Dublin, Ireland; name and address of nearest relative in country whence he came, father W.S. Carter, 13 Sto... Street, Dublin; final destination, New York, NY.

    One possibility for Francis is the 33 year old Francis Carter, clerk, on a list of cabin passengers on the 'Umbria', leaving Queenstown 15 July 1901; ticket no. 13055. So far I haven't spotted him arriving at the other end.

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