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  1. #11
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Here is James at 26 Canrobert Street in 1912
    London Electoral Registers 1847 to1965
    James Fitzsimmonds
    Electoral year 1912
    Parliamentary division Bethnal Green, South West
    County/Borough Tower Hamlets

    He is still there in 1914 but after that there is a James Fitzsimmons but at different addresses so no telling if he is yours.

  2. #12
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Ok I have spent ages going around the traps with this one. The only contender I can find for James Fitzsimmonds (and all variations) in 1881 is this one.
    RG11/318/68/1
    James Fitzsimmonds Widow 30 cabinet maker Spitalfields
    Ann E dau 9 Bethenal Green
    Sarah R 3 dau B G
    Mary A dau 18 months B G
    James Fitzsimmonds 7 B G
    There is also a Rebecca Ester married born L/pool, a boarder with her children all born Blackfriars.

    So I went looking for a marriage for this James
    15 June 1868 Shoreditch (GRO ref 1c/360)
    Parish of St John’s ? Baptist Hoxton.
    James Fitzsimmons Joiner bachelor Living at Hem?forth Street, father Cornelius Fitzsimmons Gardener
    Mary Eliza Pratt widow, Gopsall Street, father Richard West, Smith(blacksmith?)

    After much searching came up with this in 1871 census RG10/417/40/7
    ? F? Fitzsimmons Head 36 Shirt Dresser born Woodmenson, no county
    George Pratt son 17
    James Pratt 11 son
    Mary E Fitzsimmons dau 18 months
    No husband present but does tie in the Pratt and Fitzsimmonds marriage in 1868
    Also 1861 Mary E is with husband George 34 a shirt dresser children George J(T? S?) 6
    Jane M 4, Mary S(?) 3 and John R 1. Plus Maria west wife's mother 60 family laundress Reigate Surrey
    These children need sorting from the one’s in 1871.

    In amongst all this I haven’t yet found James with Mary E or anywhere else in 1871.
    There is no evidence to say that this James in 1871 is yours but at the moment he is the likeliest candidate.
    Can't find any of James children from the 1881 in 1891 but have found Ann E in 1901 and 1911 unmarried and a household servant.

  3. #13
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Following the James Fitzsimmonds who married Mary E Pratt nee West stating father Cornelius Fitzsimmons I found this. Something to file in the "maybe pile"
    Marriage 20 Nov 1831 by Licence
    Bath, St Michael
    Groom Cornelius Fitzsimmons bachelor
    Groom - Of this parish
    Bride Sarah Marchant, Spinster
    Bride's parish, Laycock Wiltshire

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by christanel View Post
    Baptism of Richard
    Richard William Fitzsimmons
    Estimated birth date abt 1899
    Baptism Date 8 Mar 1899
    Saint Andrew Bethnal Green
    Father James Fitzsimmons Cabinet maker
    Mother Sarah Fitzsimmons
    Address Warburton Square Warburton Road Hackney
    Parish Bethnal Green St Andrew
    Tower Hamlets
    Parish Bethnal Green
    This looks like one of the children who died
    Baptism Margaret Fitzsimmonds
    Baptism 11 Jan 1905 Birth date Dec 2(?) 1904
    Father James Fitzsimmonds Chair maker
    Mother Sarah Fitzsimmonds
    Address 2 Smith's Buildings
    Parish Bethnal Green St Thomas Tower Hamlets
    thanks christanel
    i looked at those yesterday and have put them on the tree with a ? because of the address

    the time line goes
    1896 lilliam williams 50 chambord st ( obviously illegitamate)
    1897 (apparently a marriage which i cannot find as stated on 1911 census married for 14 yrs)
    1899 richard william fitzsimmonds 39 warburton sq
    1900 adelaide fitzsimmonds 50 chambord st
    1905 margaret fitzsimmonds 2 smiths buildings
    1902 louisa fitzsimmonds no address
    1904 george fitzsimmonds no address
    1901 census 50 chambord st
    1911 census 26 canroberts st
    1912 electoral role james 26 canroberts st
    1914 electoral role james 26 canroberts st

    strange that richard and margaret are at different addresses when they lived at 50 chambord from at least 1896 to 1901 and the other births state jame as a chair maker
    thanks
    lisagrace
    Last edited by christanel; 18-10-2016 at 8:49 PM. Reason: forgot occupation

  5. #15
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    my word cant believe youve spent that much time on me i'm really grateful theres alot to look at lots of possibilities.
    thankyou.

  6. #16
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    1896 Lillian Williams 50 Chambord st illegitimate
    1897 supposed marriage as stated on 1911 census married for 14 yrs BUT no evidence of this.
    1899 Richard William Fitzsimmonds 39 Warburton Sq
    1900 Adelaide Fitzsimmonds 50 Chambord St
    1901 Chambord St. This is the only time Sarah and James are seen together
    1905 Margaret Fitzsimmonds 2 Smiths Buildings
    1902 Louisa Fitzsimmonds no address
    1904 George Fitzsimmonds no address
    1911 census 26 Canroberts St
    1912 electoral role James 26 Canroberts St
    1914 electoral role James 26 Canroberts St

    I am beginning to wonder if James was running two households!! The odd ones out are Richard's and Margaret's bpt addresses.

  7. #17
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Chair maker, joiner, cabinet maker all aspects of same area of expertise.

    If the James Fitzsimmonds in 1881 with children Ann, Sarah etc is yours (and I cant find them in 1881)
    his age was 30 so born c1851.
    In 1901 your James was age 48 so born c1853, a couple of years difference is no big deal.
    If these two are one and the same and it is also the James who married Mary Eliza Pratt nee West in 1868 then he was 18 years old when he married a widow of 33.
    Now did she die or did he up and leave her for a younger woman or are there at least 2 and possibly 3 James Fitzsimmonds.

    Also to take in to consideration are the variant spellings of Fitzsimmonds plus the name Simmonds/Simmons could have had the Fitz added to it or removed.

    My head hurts.

  8. #18
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    And I haven't even taken a closer look at Sarah williams. I did see one born Bethnal Green in the 1881 census but no way of knowing if she is yours.

  9. #19
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    adelaide 1900's daughter, was my nan her name was grace adelaide. She passed away on the 15th april aged 91, we have just had her funeral it was very sad. I have done my grandfathers tree and thought its time to do hers its a shame we always do things like this when its too late too ask questions.

    christanel " Ok I have spent ages going around the traps with this one. The only contender I can find for James Fitzsimmonds (and all variations) in 1881 is this one.
    RG11/318/68/1
    James Fitzsimmonds Widow 30 cabinet maker Spitalfields
    Ann E dau 9 Bethenal Green
    Sarah R 3 dau B G
    Mary A dau 18 months B G
    James Fitzsimmonds 7 B G
    There is also a Rebecca Ester married born L/pool, a boarder with her children all born Blackfriars."

    you wrote the above and i kept looking and there is a marriage for

    james fitzsimmonds couch maker 30 gladstone buildings b/green father james patrick fitzsimmons
    to ann eleanor solkham at st james shoreditch 1872

    this would tie in with the ann e child

    if he's mine great, though i think your assumptions of him seem to be correct i think he had afew on the go with quite a few kids.

    My nans younger sisters have just said that they think he was married a few times, but i dont think he married them all!!!!

  10. #20
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    christanel. can you look at that 1881 census again rg11/318/68/1 with ann e on it
    look above james the first on the address is sarah folkhom w 50
    rather similar to solkhon could she be james mother in law ?
    if ann e is ann eleanor daughter of ann eleanor fitzsimmons formerly solkham married 1872

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