Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 14
  1. #1
    wendy lou
    Guest

    Smile Trying to Locate Birth

    I hope someone out there can help me. For the last 5 years I have been trying to locate my Great Grandfathers birth but with no luck. According to the 1901 census he was born Alfred Symonds (although his marriage certificate says Simonds) about 1864 in Risley Bedfordshire. According to the marriage certificate his fathers name was William. I have looked at the birth index's on microfilm and on Find My Past and Free BMD - I live in Australia which makes physically going to the GRO in England somewhat difficult. Any advice on other options would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Wendy lou

  2. #2
    oxon57
    Guest

    Default

    According to the 1901 census he was born Alfred Symonds (although his marriage certificate says Simonds) about 1864 in Risley Bedfordshire.
    ...and in 1861 his parents are Simonds, but in 1871 they are Simants.
    In 1881 they are still Simants, but Alf has joined the army and he (or his C/O) thinks he's Simmonds.
    In 1871 they think Alf is only 6, but in 1881 he's allegedly 18.
    I didn't bother to look at 1891 - I've seen enough, they don't really have a clue, do they?

    Now, can you afford to risk £7 on a possible wrong certificate?

    The registration district for Riseley is Bedford, so let's assume that they did manage to find their way to the register office and see what we have as a possible.

    If he were mine, subject to further investigation (I've only done this quickly, so do please see if you can find fault with it before you part with any money) I think I would invest £7 in:

    Alfred SIMON - 1864 September quarter, Bedford 3b 292

    A quick test (no variables used, so by no means thorough) shows nobody at all by the surname of Simon in the whole of Bedfordshire on the 1861 census.
    In 1871 there is one couple, in Sandy, John and Elizabeth, but as Elizabeth is 64 years old, she's hardly likely to be the mother of a child born in 1864.
    I don't see a death for him prior to 1871, and I don't see a Bedfordshire-born Alfred Simon anywhere else in the country in 1871.
    Furthermore, looking at the image of the index page for that registration, it's a typed page, and the typed pages are generally even less reliable than the rest of the GRO index.

    Does this Alfred "SIMON" really exist? Spend a day on it, not just my quick attempt, and see if *you* can find him?

    If not he's probably your Alfred Simants/Simmonds/Symonds/Simonds.

  3. #3
    Famous for offering help & advice michaelpipe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Adelaide, South Australia
    Posts
    1,687

    Default

    Maybe this will help

    1881 census
    33rd Brigade Depot, Bedford Militia, Kempston, Beds

    Alfred Simmonds, age 18, soldier, rank: private, born Riseley, Beds

    1871 census
    138 High Street, Risely (sic), Beds
    The name is written Simants in the original
    William Simants, head, mar, age 37, farm labourer, b Swineshead, Hunts
    Helen ? (looks like Keren) , wife, age 35, Lacemaker, born Molchbourne, Beds
    Samuel, son, age 11, scholar, born Risely, Beds
    Jane, daur, age 8, scholar, born Risely, Beds
    Alfred, son, age 6, scholar, born Risely, Beds
    Arthur, son, age 2, born Risely scholar, born Risely, Beds, Beds

    Michael

  4. #4
    JPBeds
    Guest

    Default Alfred Symants

    Wendy, He was baptised 7/04/1865 at Riseley, Beds son of William Symants & Karrenhappuch Lynes. William was born 1834 Swineshead, Hunts & Karren born 1836 Melchbourne, & they married 26/7/1858 at Riseley.

    William Symants was son of Amos Symants & Elizabeth Harris who married 27/04/1832 at Swineshead.
    When Elizabeth died in May 1861, Amos married Eliza Thornton on 6/12/1861, She was born Eliza Gell & was widow of Henry Thornton

    Amos Symants b 1813 Riseley was son of Samuel Symants & Susannah Manning, who married 10/12/1810 at Chelveston

    Samuel Manning was born 1789 Chelveston, Northants son of William Symants & Martha Clapham

    I have him in my family tree as his family has links by marriage to varioius North Beds names that also connect to my Partridge family.

    He has had many names over the censuses & registers.

    Regards John P, Bedford.

  5. #5
    oxon57
    Guest

    Default

    Edit - my apologies for probable confusion, John P, the following was intended as a reply to Michael - your message appeared while I was typing.

    Yes, that's the family that I referred to as being Simonds in 1861 then Simants in 1871 and 1881.
    "Looks like Keren" - and, while I didn't bother to look at the image, it probably is.
    If you go back to 1861 (again I haven't looked at the image), a well-known company have her as "Hern Hoppuch Simonds".
    Another £7 says she's some variation of that name with umpteen spellings, sometimes as one word, sometimes two, sometimes hyphenated, and it's something along the lines of Keranhappech.

    But can you see the Alfred SIMON listed in 1864 that I referred to?
    It's obvious from the census who Alfred the name-changer's parents are, but is that his birth registration?
    Last edited by oxon57; 11-09-2008 at 6:01 AM. Reason: clarification

  6. #6
    wendy lou
    Guest

    Default

    Thankyou both for your speedy response to my enquiry. I have wondered for a while and made contact with someone related to the above Simant family and we shared they sent me a couple of photo's to compare with my great grandfather's family and there is a definite resemblance. I have also looked at the Birth for the September Q 1864 and consider ordering a certificate. To be fair I usually order certificates when I am positive of the result or have very strong intuitive hunch which so far has only been wrong once and I have ordered more than 40 certificates. I will do some more research and give some serious thought to ordering the certificate. Thank you again for your assistance it is greatly appreciated. Wendy

  7. #7
    wendy lou
    Guest

    Default

    John P Bedford

    Thankyou for that information. I can't believe it was so easy to get guidance using this website. You have confirmed along with OXON 57 and michael pipe the information I had already come across and with Alfred's possible birth having been recorded as Alfred Simon I have somewhere to advance to.

    Thank you again
    Wendy

  8. #8
    JPBeds
    Guest

    Default Amos Symants

    Amos Symants sister was Temperance b 1819 Riseley & she married Thomas Wildman.
    For more info that includes Symants details on that see RootsChat topic

    www. rootschat. com/forum/index.php/topic,192610.0.html

    That's another smilar useful website for good information.

    Cheers John
    Last edited by AdeleE; 03-10-2010 at 12:40 AM. Reason: Removed clicky link to Rootschat

  9. #9
    wendy lou
    Guest

    Default Re Alfred Simon birth 1864

    To All who offered suggestions and information,

    Thankyou all. Especially Oxon 57 who game me birth details for an Alfred Simon 1864 in Bedford. I have since received the certificate for this particular birth. While waiting for it to arrive I went through the certificates I have requested in the past and upon checking Alfred's death certificate this time around I noticed the comment "also SIMON" on it which I had not noticed before. Thanks to all of your help and assistance and that little extra piece of information I now have the connection between my Alfred Simonds/Symonds/Simon and William Simants and Keren Happuch Lines and so beyond.

    Thank you again for all of your help it is greatly appreciated.

  10. #10
    Simants
    Guest

    Default

    I would like to find some information on William Simants, b.1834 and Karrenhappuch Lynes. they were my 4th generation great grandparents. If you would know there parents and on before them if possible.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Select a file: