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  1. #21
    BillJ
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrevorFranklin View Post
    Sue
    I descend from the Pooles that you are talking about.
    Can go back as far as Edward and Mary.
    William was my 3xGt Grandfather.

    Regards
    Trev
    Hello Trev,

    I am the cousin of Sue's husband who has been searching for the parentage of Thomas Poole (my gg grandfather). Thomas of Tetbury appears to be a likely match on several counts. However, the picture of Thomas as supplied by another Poole descendant is somewhat puzzling as he looks to have non- white European facial features. Might you happen to have any family pictures of your ggg grandfather William or his children?

    Regards,
    Bill

  2. #22
    TrevorFranklin
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    Hi Bill/Sue


    William Poole and Mary Butler, according to parish records and census images, had 15 children.
    Their first son was William born 1799 and died 1858. He was a stone mason

    The next son was Dennis, born 1803. He moved to Monmouthshire and was a stone mason. (I have a contact Cathy Susan who descends from his line)
    The Thomas that you speak of was born c1808 in Tetbury.

    There are a number of Poole families in the Tetbury/Malmesbury/Crudwell area, who were involved in stone masonry, but no further Thomas' appear.

    I know of the image that you are refering to, as I have a copy (source Audry ORegan), and agree it looks more Afrocaribean than European and doubt it is a correct image.
    I know that the Thomas that you are referring to left England for New York in April of 1836, but have not done anything on following up, as my main line is from his brother William (1799). Have you seen a copy of the passenger list, as these give age in most cases, so could be cross referenced with known DoB?

    My William married Esther Garrett 1823 in Tetbury.
    They had 12 children, one being Eliza, born 1834 in Crudwell.
    SHe had two illegitimate children, in both cases, father unknown, as the workhouse records were destroyed.
    Denis born 1852 (in Brokenborugh workhouse)
    Edwin Julian 1855.

    Denis was my Gt grandfather, images of him and my Grandfather Frederick Bruce Poole can be found at this website address
    https://www.pursglove.talktalk.net/po...bury/Cover.htm

    I do know that two of Denis' sons (William and Alfred) emigrated to Canada, Arthur in 1911 and William in 1922.
    Arthur's descendents still live in Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan

    Hope this helps in some way?

    I also have some later photographs of William in Canada and of the descendents of Arthur, but would need an email address to send them to if you PM me.

    Regards
    Trevor

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillJ View Post
    Hello Trev,

    I am the cousin of Sue's husband who has been searching for the parentage of Thomas Poole (my gg grandfather). Thomas of Tetbury appears to be a likely match on several counts. However, the picture of Thomas as supplied by another Poole descendant is somewhat puzzling as he looks to have non- white European facial features. Might you happen to have any family pictures of your ggg grandfather William or his children?

    Regards,
    Bill
    Hey Bill!

    Welcome to the forum.....

    Maybe we will find some answers yet! It sure would be great to go further back and I know my hubby would be thrilled if Trev can give us some answers. Unfortunatly it won't quit snowing in our lea of the lake area and hubby is one tired snow-plow operator. I'll email you shortly.

    Sue

  4. #24
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    Hello again, Trev!

    Sorry, I forgot to welcome you to the forum as well
    This is a great place to make alot of friends and receive as well as give some help along the way.
    Thankyou so much for all the information you have given us. I know Bill has been working a long time on the Poole family and every once in awhile I will stick my 2 cents worth in. Not alot of help so far, but I am trying....After all, I have a Poole desendant for a husband and he just doesn't understnd why it is taking me so long to find out some information! Once I have digested some of this information I may send you a PM with my email so we can exchange more info.

    Sue

  5. #25
    BillJ
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    Hello Trev,

    Thank you so much for the information and links to your Poole family.

    Personally, I think there can be little doubt that our Thomas is your ggg grandfather's brother.

    1/ Location - family account says he was from Malmesbury, Gloucestershire. Tetbury is on the outskirts of Malmesbury, Wiltshire but on the Gloucestershire side.

    2/ Profession - Stonemason - Thomas of Tebury's father & brothers were stonemasons so he was likely a stonemason.

    3/ Thomas of Tetbury Emigrated: Thomas does not appear on English records after 1840 so he must have either emigrated or died but I can find no record of his death.

    4/ Age: Thomas Pool, age 28, arrived in New York on the Barque Union on the 7th of June 1836. Family account says he arrived in New York mid June 1836 - a match. This is also a match for the Baptism year of Thomas in Tetbury - 1808. 1808 is also the birth year of our Thomas on a Canadian census although this date differs from his death certificate which indicates an 1806 birth. I don't know if baptisms are always within one year of birth?

    If the Thomas Poole on the Barque Union from England arriving June 1836 happened to be another Thomas Poole who coincidentally arrived at the same time as mine and was coincidentally the same age then that one would have likely remained in the US and would be on later US census records. I have searched the US records and there does not appear to be a Thomas Poole born in England of a similar age so I believe this is my Thomas whose age matches Thomas of Tetbury.

    Thomas travelled with an Elizabeth Pool. If his wife she must have shortly died as he later married in 1838 or, alternatively, she may have been a relative but not his sister as
    sister Elizabeth continued to live in England.

    I am somewhat confused on Thomas & Williams father, Edward Poole. I looked at the IGI site and found 2 marriages for Edward Poole in Tetbury - 1806 to Lizzie Thornhill & 1818 to Maria Thornhill. Also the 1841 census has much younger ages from the baptism dates for Ann, Eliza & John although Adams is closer.

    So if this is one Edward Poole it appears he married 3 times and the Mary Poole of the census & who died 1862 is Mary Thornhill and not Mary Butler. Whether the ages in the census are off or whether there were more later children using the same names as earlier siblings is another query or were there 3 different Edward Pooles in Tetbury? Don't know whether it is possible to sort out.

    Thanks again for your help.

    Regards,

    Bill

  6. #26
    TrevorFranklin
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillJ View Post
    I am somewhat confused on Thomas & Williams father, Edward Poole. I looked at the IGI site and found 2 marriages for Edward Poole in Tetbury - 1806 to Lizzie Thornhill & 1818 to Maria Thornhill. Also the 1841 census has much younger ages from the baptism dates for Ann, Eliza & John although Adams is closer.

    So if this is one Edward Poole it appears he married 3 times and the Mary Poole of the census & who died 1862 is Mary Thornhill and not Mary Butler. Whether the ages in the census are off or whether there were more later children using the same names as earlier siblings is another query or were there 3 different Edward Pooles in Tetbury? Don't know whether it is possible to sort out.
    Taken from Peter Hancock's website for the ThornHills of Tetbury.
    "A not uncommon practice occurred in 1806 and 1818, when Edward Pool(e) first married Eliza then her younger sister, Maria. Eliza had two children, Edward and Edwyn. The Christmas of 1811 was a tragic one for the Pool family. Edwyn was buried at twelve months old, on Christmas day, his mother being buried four days later. Eliza was buried as a pauper, reflecting the family’s financial circumstances at the time. In the 1851 census widow Maria was also recorded as a pauper."
    Source: https://www.phancocks.pwp.blueyonder....ill/thorn2.htm

    Trev

  7. #27
    TrevorFranklin
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    I forgot to add, that the Parish transcripts list the marriage of Edward Poole to both Eliza and then Maria.
    In his marriage to Eliza, he is listed as being a widower, so his marriage to Eliza was at least his second, with his later marriage to Eliza's sister (Maria) being his third.

    The record of Edward's marriage to Eliza is the first time he appears in the Tetbury area, so it is assumed he came from outside of the area.

    Ultimately, this is proving he is not our Edward

    Trev

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrevorFranklin View Post
    I forgot to add, that the Parish transcripts list the marriage of Edward Poole to both Eliza and then Maria.
    In his marriage to Eliza, he is listed as being a widower, so his marriage to Eliza was at least his second, with his later marriage to Eliza's sister (Maria) being his third.

    The record of Edward's marriage to Eliza is the first time he appears in the Tetbury area, so it is assumed he came from outside of the area.

    Ultimately, this is proving he is not our Edward

    Trev
    Just when I had printed everything off so I could sort it out I am now even more confused..............

    Sue

  9. #29
    BillJ
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    Hello Trev & other Poole descendants,

    Several of the children listed as being of Edward Poole & Mary Butler appear not to have been theirs.

    - Edward & Edwyn (as per the Thornhill Family Site) were the children of the other Edward Poole & wife Lizzie Thornhill.
    - Timothy was the child of that Edward & his later wife Maria Thornhill.

    Some Poole family trees show marriages for Ann & John but the 1861 census has them both in their 50's unmarried & living with their mother & John listed as 'blind from birth'.

    So the 11 children of our Edward & Mary appear to be: William, Jane, Dennis, Ann, Eliza,
    John, Thomas, Mary, Richard, Peter & Adam.

    Bill

  10. #30
    TrevorFranklin
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillJ View Post
    Hello Trev & other Poole descendants,

    Several of the children listed as being of Edward Poole & Mary Butler appear not to have been theirs.

    - Edward & Edwyn (as per the Thornhill Family Site) were the children of the other Edward Poole & wife Lizzie Thornhill.
    - Timothy was the child of that Edward & his later wife Maria Thornhill.

    Some Poole family trees show marriages for Ann & John but the 1861 census has them both in their 50's unmarried & living with their mother & John listed as 'blind from birth'.

    So the 11 children of our Edward & Mary appear to be: William, Jane, Dennis, Ann, Eliza,
    John, Thomas, Mary, Richard, Peter & Adam.

    Bill
    Hi Bill
    Though the children are on the Thornhill site, they have no positive proof that they were the children of Edward Poole and Maria Thornhill.
    IGI has parents as Edward and mary.

    For that reason, I have still kept them as children for our Edward and mary, but with a note to remind me of the other Edward and Mary (Maria), basically in either case it is a guess who the parents were.

    trev

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