Help with records for 5th Dragoon Guards

[carol47]

I am trying to trace my grandfather. I can find no records of his birth but I have his marriage certificate to Sarah Mabel Southwell on 21st June 1915 on which he states he is 23 years old and a private with the 5th Dragoon Guards and his father is Albert James Wood (deceased). I can't find any details of his wife either but that's another story.

That is all I know. If anybody can help with a service record I would be eternally grateful.
Thank you
Carol

[thewideeyedowl]

Hi Carol and a very warm welcome to Brit Gen...

Well, a quick check on FreeBMD for the marriage between your grandparents suggests that your grandfather was Albert J Wood, in which case it looks as if he was named for his father. (The only other possibility is a Walter G Westrope, but I am disregarding that one.)

Medal Index Cards can be found at The National Archives (TNA). I found none for (Albert J Wood AND Dragoon Guards), but when I changed this to just (Albert Wood AND Dragoon Guards) there were two strong possibilities, as you will see here:http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/s/res?_aq=%28Wood%2C+Albert%29AND+%28NOT+A+AND+NOT+E %29+AND+%28Dragoon+Guards%29&_ep=&_or1=Medal&_or2=&_or3=&_nq1=Police&_nq2=Divorce&_nq3=Plaintiff&_sd=1914&_ed=1920&_col=0&_sw=ref&_cr1=&_cr2=&_cr3=&_ps=15&_ro=any&_rd=&_rsd=&_red=&_fr=&_st=adv. A MIC can be downloaded from TNA for a small fee, but I would not advise doing this until you are sure of identification.

Unfortunately, about 60% of service personnel records from WW1 were destroyed in a disastrous fire during the London Blitz, so it really is pot-luck as to whether your man's record has survived. The surviving records have been digitised and are available on Ancestry. It is usually possible to use Ancestry for free in your local library, so I suggest you try that first before splashing out any money. And while you are on Ancestry, you can try to find both your grandparents in the 1911 and 1901 censuses; you will then, most likely, have the names of some family members, where they were living, and what they were doing.

Also, take a look at this very informative site, The Long Long Trail: http://www.1914-1918.net. Enter Dragoon Guards in the search box there to get some background.

You should also try to read the excellent, but sometimes rather long, Research Guides on TNA's website.

It is going to be a long interesting search , so please get back to us with the things you find - and, of course, more questions.

Owl

[carol47]

Thanks for your reply. I have his marriage certificate but am unable to find mention of him on 1901 or 1911 census so don't know where he was born. I was hoping that his service record would say where, do you know if it would say that? I am already using Ancestry to do the family tree but it's not helping.

[thewideeyedowl]

Hi again, Carol

Think I might have found Albert's birth registration. As he states on his marriage cert that he is 23 (and if he isn't fibbing!) he must have been born between July 1991 and June 1892. FreeBMD has this registration in the March quarter of 1892:

WOOD, Albert John Edmonton Vol 3a p299

This Albert is the seventh (of ten) registrations recorded in Edmonton in this quarter, which suggests to me that he was born in late Feb or in March 1892.

Couldn't find a Sarah Mabel Southwell anywhere between 1885 and 1896. BUT I did find this registration in the September quarter of 1896:

SOUTHWELL, Sarah Marion Wandsworth Vol 1d p596

Those dates and areas seem about right for this couple. What do you think?

Ancestry seems to be down at the moment, but when you can log on again, I suggest that you try to search for the Albert found above in Military. He may have been known in the army as 'Albert Wood'. That was the name on the two possible MICs I found. Note down the service numbers and then run a search in the Military section using both this version of his name and those numbers.

Ancestry also has the MICs, so try to view both those on the site. Sometimes - if you are very lucky - there will be a bit of extra info on the back.

Census search can be difficult because of mistranscriptions, so you will need to use some wild cards (check out how to do it on Ancestry). Also, did either of these grandparents have a sibling? If you know the name, then try to find the sibling on the census, and that may lead you to the grandparent you are looking for.

IF you can find one of your grandparents, then look 'three doors down' for the other one - or at least in the near neighbourhood. That often works.

Must do other things now.

Let us know how you get on.

Owl

[carol47]

Well I got the service records, there were two so cost £6.60. This is what I got, which isn't at all helpful.

http://www.british-genealogy.com/forums/extensions/uploads/7102415e-7934-4f95-a036-685ba2b2e62e.jpg

Thanks for your help.
Carol

[carol47]

Thank Owl, Sarah Marion Southwell is wrong father, he is William Southwell, mine is Harry Southwell, I've been down that route. Both fathers are deceased on the marriage certificate but I will not know when they died.

[thewideeyedowl]

Looks as if he was discharged because he was unfit: http://www.forrestdale.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/KingsRegs1912/para-16.html. You seem to have more info than you are disclosing.

Please give us ALL the info you have, eg names etc, then we can try to give constructive help.

Owl

[carol47]

Here's the information:-

Frederick A Wood born 1921 Wandsworth London to Albert James Wood & Sarah Mabel Southwell. Albert & Sarah married on 21 June 1915, both put their age as 23, both were single and Albert put his rank or profession as private 5th Dragoon Guard. His father was Albert James Wood (deceased) Borough Council labourer and her father was Harry Southwell (deceased) railway porter. I cannot find anything about either of them. There is a Sarah Marion Southwell but she has William as her father. I'm beginning to think these two made up their details, that is why I was hoping there might be something on his military record but sadly, no.

If you can throw any light on this I would be very thankful.
Carol

[simmo1]

Hi

You don't have his service records, just medal index cards, the one you posted refers to the Silver War Badge roll which is on Ancestry and will give a bit more details.

From here - http://www.1914-1918.net/soldiers/soldiersrecord.html

service records are here -
Guards regimental collections. The Guards regiments maintained a separate set of records and these are accessible via the Archivists of those regiments, all of whom can be contacted at the respective regimental headquarters at

The Regimental Archivist of the [name] Guards,
Wellington Barracks,
Birdcage Walk,
London SW1E 6HQ.

The Guards regiments require payment for supplying a copy. In all cases you should at first write, asking for a copy of the form that the regimental archivist requires in order to carry out a search.


regards

Robert

[carol47]

Have sent letter today, thank you.