William Hodges - Yeoman

[DoreenH]

hi All
I hope some one can help. We have a William Hodges (wife Ann) whose son Thomas Hodges born All Saints Hereford marrying his 2nd wife Sarah Edwards 8 Feb 1838 Cheltenham Gloucestershire. On Thomas marriage cert, it states his father William is a Yeoman.
Trying to find more info on William Hodges and his wife Ann. It is mentioned earlier that Yeoman are just a bit lower than gentry. Where would I go to try and find more info. There are a lot of Hodges. I have had help on my other request with his son Thomas in the innkeeper section. thanking you, Doreen, Australia

[christanel]

Hi Doreen
I have given your post a spot of its own in the Herefordshire forum. That way it will generate more attention. :smile5:

This
(http://www.british-genealogy.com/forums/showthread.php/78824-innkeeper-Thomas-Hodges) is the link to the other post that Doreen refers to.
Christina

[kiwicatz]

hi All
I hope some one can help. We have a William Hodges (wife Ann) whose son Thomas Hodges born All Saints Hereford marrying his 2nd wife Sarah Edwards 8 Feb 1838 Cheltenham Gloucestershire. On Thomas marriage cert, it states his father William is a Yeoman.
Trying to find more info on William Hodges and his wife Ann. It is mentioned earlier that Yeoman are just a bit lower than gentry. Where would I go to try and find more info. There are a lot of Hodges. I have had help on my other request with his son Thomas in the innkeeper section. thanking you, Doreen, Australia

I have a similar interest - my relative Hugh Crosby, who died about 1678 is described in his will as a Husbandman, I assume this is like a Yeoman, and later a Farmer or Landholder. Another relative, William Crosby died about 1640, but there is nothing in his will that says what his occupation was. Can you tell me what to look for to get some idea of his status. And was 30 ponds a lot of money back in 1640?
Regards
Jan

[Allan F Sparrow]

Husbandman did rather imply someone who controlled a farm, rather than just working on one for somebody else. In the 19th century censuses, it's the difference between being called a farmer and being called an agricultural labourer (often ag.lab. for brevity). The word yeoman usually meant such a farmer. Some yeomen were well below the gentry, and some were so little below that they might rise into the gentry. Similarly, gentlemen could be of very varied wealth, and the term was used in different ways by different people, depending on how secure their gentility was! People's status in the 17th century would generally be estimated by birth (i.e. family history) and by the extent of their land. If you find your man called a gentleman, or clearly in possession of more than just a farm, then you can see what that means; but if not, then he would stand lower in the social scale, obviously. The wife he was able to marry would be another indication, if you knew anything about her family.

As for the value of 30 pounds: I think it would be fair to say that one individual could live (frugally perhaps) on that sum for maybe five or six years, but it's hard to make direct value comparisons, because there was so much less that most people could spend money on in those days.

I hope this is some help!

[Megan Roberts]

I find this a very useful site when trying to get an idea about old occupations and what they entailed: http://rmhh.co.uk/occup/index.html


It defines Husbandman as:
"1) Tenant farmer 2) Farmer dealing with animals (14th century From the Anglo-Saxon husbonda) - a shepherd"
Yeoman as:
1) Farmer who owns his own land rather than a tenant farmer; qualified to serve on juries and vote for shire representatives. 2) Assistant to an official. 3) Crewmember (Navy petty officer) in charge of ship's stores.

[Allan F Sparrow]

Thanks for the web reference. However, both the dictionaries in my possession say that husband is from Old Norse meaning (literally) house-dweller - not specifically a shepherd. So, "you pays your money and you takes your choice"! The first definition of yeoman is spot on for the original usage, of course.

[Peter Goodey]

UK Residents - please don't forget the wealth of online reference material available through your local library service. This usually includes The Oxford Dictionary of Local and Family History which is well worth a look. For example

Husbandman: The old word for a farmer below the rank of yeoman. A husbandman usually held his land by copyhold or leasehold tenure and may be regarded as the ‘average farmer in his locality’. The words ‘yeoman’ and ‘husbandman’ were gradually replaced in the later 18th and 19th centuries by ‘farmer’.

[janbooth]

Hi again Doreen,

I do not know whether this will be relevant to your William HODGES but Dymock is relatively close to both Hereford & Cheltenham. Hereford Journal dated 19 April 1809 gives details of Land to be sold at Auction "Arable Land lying in Common Field, known as Snatch Field, bounded on the north by land of John THACKWELL, Esq., and on the south by lands of William HODGES". Speculative, I know but as your William was a Yeoman .... Another article in 1814 which states "part of the Estate called Leddington Farm situated in Dymock in the occupation of the Proprietor Mr William HODGES". Although on further consideration, I do not think this William HODGES is likely to be your William as the Gloucestershire Wills on Ancestry show Wills for William HODGES as Dymock going a fair way back.

Perhaps another possibility is a Death Notice in the Hereford Journal dated 21 February 1827 - "On Friday last at Hom Lacey, Mr William HODGES, late of the Above Eign in this city, in the 61st year of his age".

Ancestry Select Births & Christenings show a baptism at All Saints Hereford on 12 April 1803 for an Elizabeth daughter of William & Ann HODGES - perhaps the sister of Thomas?

Not much help here, I'm afraid, but will keep looking.

Janet

[DoreenH]

Hi Janet.thankyou for your tremendous help.
What I have for son Thomas is:
Thomas born 1795 All Saints Hereford. died 25 Oct 1858 Union workhouse cheltenham gloucestershire.
1st wife: Catherine Baugh born 1803 Marden, died 1 Jul 1835 Woolhope Herefordshire. daughter of Henry Baugh and Mary Oliver. 2nd wife: Sarah Edwards born 1802 Selleck Herefordshire, died 1876 Cheltenham Gloucestershire.
children of Thomas and Catherine: William born 1826-1908; John 1828-1828; Thomas 1829; George 1832. children of Thomas and Sarah: Frederick 1844-1867; Sarah 1847-1853.
with regard to William and Ann. All I have is possible marriage 1795 Hereford. Dont know Ann's maiden name. William's occupation was listed on Thomas marriage cert to Sarah.
Its a pity that in England, they dont mention mothers names on death and marriage cert.
Here in Australia. on all birth, death and marriage cert, both parents are listed. on Birth cert, both parents including their occupations and places of birth plus any siblings. On death cert, it also states both parents, all previous marriages and names and ages of all children at time of death.
I will keep looking. I have 2 options for Ann's maiden name: Minton and Bridges. these seem to match close to the time period.Doreen

I have a similar interest - my relative Hugh Crosby, who died about 1678 is described in his will as a Husbandman, I assume this is like a Yeoman, and later a Farmer or Landholder. Another relative, William Crosby died about 1640, but there is nothing in his will that says what his occupation was. Can you tell me what to look for to get some idea of his status. And was 30 ponds a lot of money back in 1640?
Regards
Jan

[DoreenH]

dear Allan
thank you for your help.
I will try and find info on farms in that area. Its a bit hard from Australia.
Some family history centres offer help and no charge. many want to charge a lot.
I prefer to try and get help online and offer help in return.
thanking you
Doreen

[janbooth]

Doreen,

At least you seem to have progressed somewhat since your first posting as your now have Thomas's baptism as 1795 at All Saints, Hereford and know from his marriage certificate that his father is William and a Yeoman. I can only find 2 possible marriages on the Herefordshire Marriage Index for a William HODGES to an Ann in Herefordshire at about the correct timescale. The first is to an Ann SCUDAMORE at St John, Hereford on 1 July 1789 with a note that both were widowed and the other to Anne BRIDGES on 12 March 1792 at All Saints, Hereford, by licence.

Looking at the Herefordshire FHS Burial Index, there are the following burials which may be relevant:

19 August 1815 at Hereford All Saints Thomas HODGES of Widemarsh Gate, aged 62
8 March 1818 at Hereford All Saints James HODGES of Above Eign, aged 6 weeks
14 September 1821 at Hereford All Saints Anne HODGES of Above Eign, aged 35
7 February 1822 at Hereford All Saints Richard HODGES of Above Eign, aged 64
9 January 1826 at Hereford All Saints Sarah HODGES of Pig Market, aged 61
19 February 1828 at Hereford All Saints Joseph HODGES of Above Eign, aged 24
16 July 1831 at Hereford St Owen Ann HODGES of St Owens Without, aged 81 - there is a burial on 22 Oct 1830 of an Edward HODGES of St Owens Without, aged 90, so perhaps these two are husband and wife
12 January 1832 at Hereford All Saints Joseph HODGES of Above Eigne, aged 22

And then there is the burial at Holme Lacey on 24 February 1821 of Wm HODGES of Hom Lacey, aged 77 which ties in with the newspaper death announcement in post 8 which also has an Above Eign connection. Whether any of these are relevant to you I have my doubts, as there is another burial at Holme Lacey for a Betty HODGES on 8 February 1827, aged 80, who would be of about the correct age to be the wife of the Wm HODGES above.

Sorry, not much help here I'm afraid. Do you have an actual baptismal record for Thomas HODGES as in the 1851 census of Cheltenham, he states that his date of birth is c1800?

Janet