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nivan21
23-11-2013, 3:23 AM
Hi everyone in this forum

I am seeking some information on a Thomas Phillips (b c1817) in Radnorshire (listed at various times as Evenist, Evenjob).

As at the 1851 Census, he was listed in Presteigne as a tailor, married to Elizabeth with their 3 children (my current working theory is the Elizabeth is Elizabeth Coniam (marriage occurring 1845 in Presteigne).

My interest is the tailoring business as he moves to the UK as at 1861 Census as a tailor.

Does anyone have any knowledge of this Phillips family history in the area or knowledge of the business itself (it may have been in the family previously)?

If it is a family business that he inherited and continued, I was hoping someone would have some knowledge of how far back, family tree history before then (I have most of what I need from this date onward)

Feedback on this is greatly appreciated.

Nick

pippycat
23-11-2013, 10:59 AM
I think this is Thomas Phillips in 1861 - which will help others who may be searching!

1861 London Census: 127 f118 p14
27 Belitha Terrace, Islington, London

Thomas Phillips 1817 Evenjobb, Radnor. Tailor Master/emply 2 men
Elizabeth 1821 Torrington, Devon
children: all born Kington, Herefordshire
Margaret 1848
Matilda 1850
William 1852
Alfred 1853
Sarah Ann 1856
Thomas 1858
Edith 1860

Evenjobb, Radnor is about 5 miles from Kington, Hereford.


As for the Tailoring being a 'family business' you would have to go back down the generations to help sort that out!

You obviously need parents of Thomas, any idea at all who they might be?

As Evenjobb is such a specific place of birth, maybe births/baps for Thomas might be a good place to start.

There is also the marriage cert for Thomas and Elizabeth Coniam, which would hopefully give father's names, but is it the correct Thomas or is it worth spending money to find out!

Just for info on the place, this is a link to Evenjobb

http://www.rgreen.org.uk/Evenjobb.html

Rebecca

janbooth
23-11-2013, 11:42 AM
I have Thomas PHILLIPS, wife Elizabeth and children Margt, Elizabeth & Matilda in Kington, Herefordshire in the 1851 census, he being shown as a Tailor born Walton, Radnorshire c1817 (HO107/2492, folio 285, pages 22/23). And could this be your Thomas in the 1841 census of Kington, Herefordshire - perhaps with siblings? (HO107/423/5, folio 29, page 27)

Bull Ring

Thomas PHILLIPS 20 Tailor Born in county yes
Sarah do 16 yes
Margaret do 15 yes

Janet

nivan21
23-11-2013, 12:00 PM
Hi Rebecca
Thank you for coming back to me so promptly.
These are the people I am seeking the info on.

The research I have done down the line has this Thomas' son, William, continuing in a business in London with an address that I am investigating in another forum.

I suppose the question I am looking to answer is that this Thomas moves from Wales to the UK as a tailor and is listed as an employer in a subsequent Census. This implies a strong and successful business/industry so I am wanting to find out why such a move and to confirm if my suspicions on that front are correct... there would possibly be local news about him, or a business directory etc.

FWIW, the marriage you list is the one I have come down the line to... this reconciles with an 1841 Census listing for Elizabeth Coniam that matches Census data of place of birth for the Elizabeth married to Thomas and also that one of Thomas' sons - Alfred - has the middle name of Coniam, matching a practice of adding maiden names as middle names to subsequent generations.

Hope this helps more and thanks again for your reply.

Nick

PS - From some rumored information I have picked up, there may or may not an address that used to be operated by a Benjamin Philipp that was then taken over by Thomas. This may be a parent but as it is all rumored, I cannot confirm anything. Even a push in the right direction of where to refer would be appreciated :)

nivan21
23-11-2013, 12:02 PM
Hi Janet
Thanks for coming back to me on this one.

The 1841 reference is possible to what I am seeking and the 1851 reference you mention is one I have used in my background research.

If you know of any business directories that would support or confirm any Thomas Phillips who work in that area?

Many thanks
Nick

pippycat
23-11-2013, 12:39 PM
Nick

Have you had a look through 'Historical Directories'?
- you can search them by location, decade and find with keywords.

One quick search of Herefordshire Post Office directory for 1856 shows a Thomas Phillips Tailor and Draper of Bridge Street, Kington.

Could be your man as his children still being born in the area at that time.

Well worth searching through the Directories Nick, never know what you may find!

Rebecca

hope link works: http://www.historicaldirectories.org/hd/d.asp

nivan21
23-11-2013, 12:58 PM
Hi Rebecca
Thank you for that - I will work my way through the link and see what I can find.

Many thanks
Nick

nivan21
23-11-2013, 12:59 PM
Hi Rebecca
Thank you for that - I will work my way through the link and see what I can find.

Many thanks
Nick

pippycat
23-11-2013, 3:27 PM
Nick

That link is only to the Hereford Directory - there are many Phillips in London (I had a look at 1884 London Business Directory)

Couple of Phillips with another surname : ie Phillips and Bolt, Tailors 27 King St, Cheapside, London
Phillips and Son, Outfitters, 11 Commercial Street, London.

but only one Thomas and one William that I could see:
Thomas Phillips, Linen Draper, 122 Lower Rd, Deptford, London
William Phillips, Tailor, 27 King Street, Soho, London.

...not really get anywhere with this kind of thing though is it :nonod:

Rebecca

nivan21
23-11-2013, 6:29 PM
Hi Rebecca
Thank you again for the extra info; the London stuff is very much appreciated!

From what I have found, the 1881 Census lists a William Ball Phillips born in Kington, Hereford with an address of 44 Churton Street St Hanover Sq. A Google maps search seems to suggest this is a business as well as residential address (especially as he is listed as being an employer). He had moved out of home by then from what it seems.

It could be possible that he now worked out of King St in 1884 (if geography makes this logical).

Question: is Cheapside and Soho the same place? Given the addresses in your post, it crosses my mind that this could well be a partnership.

Many thanks again
Nick

pippycat
23-11-2013, 11:54 PM
No Nick, not the same place - but barely 2 miles apart.

https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&channel=fflb&q=cheapside+london&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x487604aaaf76101b:0x2504fd5cac443d61,Cheaps ide,+London&gl=uk&ei=DjaRUp3wKoXQhAf6mYCwCw&ved=0CJABELYD

Maybe the 'King Street' is slightly misleading - gosh, I've just had a horrible thought, did I copy the addresses down correctly, because it does seem odd they are both exactly the same :frown5:

I'll go check and get back to you.

Rebecca

pippycat
24-11-2013, 12:04 AM
Phew! lucky for me both addresses are correct Nick.

http://www.historicaldirectories.org/hd/d.asp

There are more Phillips on the previous page as well.

Rebecca

added:
I've just noticed the link to cheapside in the previous thread doesn't show you where Soho is located.
If you use the "get directions" and put in Soho it will show you how close those 2 places are.

I'm not having much luck with these links, the Historical Directory link is also useless as comes up full of weirdness - Sorry Nick, no idea whats going on.