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Sheel
04-01-2012, 11:41 AM
Vaughan family from Portadown, Armagh. I have traced back to William Vaughan, born 1762 (d 1847) who married Hannah. Son, William Vaughan, born 1805 at Killycomaine - son Thomas Vaughan, born 1846 who became principal of Moyallon School. Anyone with links to Vaughan family from Armagh I would love to get more information.

Thank you Shelagh

MFGilbert
06-11-2013, 10:48 AM
I've just come across mentions of a Thomas Vaughan of Moyallon who was an executor on the wills of John Wycliffe Gilbert of Seagoe (died 1893) and Jonathan Gilbert of Ballinacorr (died 1896).

I don't know whether Thomas Vaughan was a relative or a friend. John Wycliffe Gilbert was a linen manufacturer, and I have seen a reference to a Thomas Vaughan of Dunbarton St, Gilford who was a mill overseer in 1910. Perhaps they were business associates? Perhaps it's a different Thomas Vaughan to yours.

Have you found any references to Gilberts?

Sheel
07-11-2013, 9:16 AM
Hello
Thank you for your really informative post. My Vaughans are very much linked to the Gilberts. William Vaughan (who I believe was a farmer - 1879 census) born 1805 d 5/8/1886 Seagoe - married Jane Gilbert at Seagoe on 7/8/1834. Jane Gilbert was from Ballinacor (she died 8/8/1879 @ Portadown). That is the sum total of information I have on the Gilberts. I have no knowledge of Jane's parents/siblings and would love some more information here. Thomas Vaughan was my great grandfather - he was born 1846 and became the Principal of the Moyallon school - he died in 1918 @ Portadown. Interestingly William Vaughan/Jane Gilbert had sons John and Jonathan which leans heavily in favour of us talking about the same family if Irish families followed naming patterns like Scots families? As I mentioned my Thomas Vaughan was a school principal not an overseer but I don't know the proximity of Gilford to Moyallon/Portadown? There was a Thomas Vaughan who signed the Covenant who was from Gilford but I don't know if this was my great grandfather or this other Thomas the overseer? I would love to exchange any more information with you and see if we can expand family tree information here.
Thanks - Shelagh

MFGilbert
07-11-2013, 10:01 PM
Hello,

Thanks for your reply (I didn't think I'd get once since you originally posted last year). I have rechecked Jonathan Gilbert's will and Thomas is indeed described as "Thomas Vaughan of Moyallan County Down National School Teacher." And in John's will he is "Thomas Vaughan of Moyallan Gilford in County Down."

I've also been sent a document which includes a letter written by a John Gilbert who refers to an Aunt Vaughan - the letter was written in 1892 and isn't clear about whether or not this Aunt Vaughan was still alive or not (it can be read either way).

Anyway, I think Jane Gilbert fits into the following family (only about 80% sure of the link) ...

Thomas Gilbert m. Sarah Forsyth
...A. Thomas (b1806)
...B. Annie (b1807)
...C. Jane (b c1808, Ballinacorr)
........married William Vaughan?
...D. Sarah Jane (b1817)
...E. William
........married Anne Anderson (?)
..........1. William Anderson Gilbert (d1915)
..........2. Catherine Jane Gilbert
..........3. Thomas Gilbert
..........4. John Wycliffe Gilbert (d1893) [refers to "Aunt Vaughan" in a letter to his Uncle James]
...F. Richard
........married Sarah/Sally Gilbert (my GG Grandfather's sister)
..........1. Anna
..........2. Mary/Minnie
...G. Jonathan
...H. James (b1825?)
........married Eliza Jane Gilbert (another of my GG Grandfather's sisters)
..........1. Annie (b1853)
..........2. Stephen (b1854)
..........3. John (b1856)
..........4. Sarah M (b1858)
..........5. Thomas (b1860)
..........6. Mary Elizabeth (b1862)

Most of the above comes from a distant cousin in New Zealand descended from James and Eliza Jane Gilbert.

I hope it rings true. If it does I'd be very interested to hear more about the extended family of William and Jane Vaughan.

kiwias
08-11-2013, 8:01 AM
Hi Shelagh, or may I call you 'cuzzie bro', as you're across the ditch :)
MF got in touch with me, out of the blue, a matter of days ago and we've had a very busy and informative exchange since.

Briefly, a great great grandfather, was a Gilbert from Armagh who, with wife and family, arrived NZ in 1863.
I am given to understand that others of this family settled in Australia, around the same time, mainly Victoria.
I've been working with a lady who is not computer literate, to discover more about the wider Gilbert family which has come to include the McCauslands, Killens, Orrs, Rountrees et al.
MF has referred me to you inasmuch as we are both aware of the name 'Vaughn' but the lady in question knows more than I.
I am visiting with her tomorrow, to discuss MF's mails with her and I will come back to you with more particulars about what she knows about Vaughn, especially with reference to the Gilberts.

In the interim, MF refers to a letter to my g-g-grandfather, written from Seagoe in 1892. Here is the text:

29 March 1892
From John Gilbert, Seagoe, Portadown
To James Gilbert, Esq., Parnell Auckland
Dear Sir
You will be surprised on receiving this from me and I feel it necessary to explain who I am and why I write, well I have been hearing of you as long as I remember from my Father and Aunt Vaughan and Uncles Richard and Jonathon and I have before now been asked if I were any relation to the Mr Gilbert who once resided in Portadown as you see that I have heard of you often while I daresay you have never heard of one. Well I am your Brother William’s youngest son and live with my mother in the old place at Seagoe. I have a Sister and Brother who live with my Aunts at Lawnmount and a Brother in America. I often intended writing to you but had not your address until last week when Cousin Annie gave it to me. I was in Ballmacorr seeing her and Uncle Jonathan they both had letters from you which I saw and they led me to form a very favourable opinion of you in more ways than one. I can see plainly you wish to do right yourself and would encourage others to do the same you made one or two scriptural references in your letter to uncle Jonathan next time you write him give him straight – He attends no church a matter that vexes me rather.
Now I do know not what to write about that would interest you most of course Portadown is greatly changed since you lived in it is now over 8000 inhabitants and is a busy little place; Spinny Mill, 3 or 4 weaving factories of … and hand loom weaving in the Country around. Power looms are taking the course end of the work from hand looms. At present moment trade in Cambric and Linen is very bad owing largely I think to the Mckinley Tariff bill of the U.S.A.
At present moment trade in Cambric and linen badly owing largely I think to the McKinley Tariff bill of the U.S.A. I am working at Machine Hemstitching and employ 9 girls and do a little in the Manufacturing line but I am only on the fringe of the business as my capital is very small indeed.
From the glowing description you give of its flowers, fruit and produce New Zealand must be a beautiful and delightful place to live in. I often wondered why you...

This was evidently more than a one page letter, but what followed has been lost

Nice to 'meet' you.

Regards
David

Sheel
09-11-2013, 8:17 AM
Well all this additional information is making my head spin. lol. I firmly believe our families are linked through Jane Gilbert's marriage to my g great grandfather William Vaughan. David you are correct, William Vaughan's son John emigrated to Australia. He married Euphemia Furphy (not sure of spelling) and they settled in Shepparton, Victoria. Their son invented the Furphy water tank around which soldiers would gather in WW1 telling yarns, and hence the Aussie expression of telling a Furphy! (bit of trivia you might be interested in) John's brother William emigrated to New Zealand around the same period. There is a very strong Vaughan presence in the Canterbury region I believe (Sefton?) I have been in contact (via Ancestry) with distant cousin John Vaughan who is a keen geneaologist. My Vaughan line goes through William's son Thomas (the school principal previously mentioned) My grandfather however, moved to Scotland, then England and most of my first cousins are still in England - although one cousin moved to Auckland. Unfortunately we have completely lost contact/knowledge with any Vaughan relatives remaining in Ireland. My mother told me of enjoyable visits she made to the Vaughan property in the 1930's and I believe Birchhill (the Vaughan farm) was sold in the 1960's and is now the site of a technical college?? I would be tickled pink to re-discover any cousins still living in Ireland.
I'm looking forward to hearing more about Jane Gilbert's family - parents and beyond. If either of you have access to the Ancestry site, my tree, Jenkins family tree is a public one and you can view the information I have gathered so far. Look forward to learning more about our mutual ancestors.
Regards Shelagh

kiwias
09-11-2013, 9:11 AM
Hi Shelagh

Oh don't worry, the confusion just gets worse. I can rattle off all about (my) Gilberts, but Vaughns are new territory for me.
Yes, I know the expression, Telling a furphy. What a hoot :) Matthew, we're going to teach you 'Strine' before we're through!
(Strine is wot Australians talk.)

Information received today -

Thomas Gilbert married Sarah Forsyth.
Seven children of the marriage:
Thomas b.1806, Annie b. 1807, Jane b. 1808, Sarah Jane b. 1817, William, Richard d. 1891, Jonathan b.1823, James b. 1825(?).

James Gilbert b. 1825 married Eliza(beth) Jane Gilbert in 1852 and this family emigrated to NZ in 1863, settling in Auckland.
James is my g-g-grandfather. I am descended from his daughter Sarah.
The lady who has provided this detail is descended from a son of James and Eliza, so we are (blood) cousins.

Daughter Sarah Jane b. 1817 married an Alexander Humphries and went to Australia.

Daughter Jane b. 1808 married William Vaughn, son of William and Hannah Vaughn.

Jane and William had issue, as they say:
George b. 1838
Sarah Ann b. 1840 - emigrated to Australia
William b. 1842 - emigrated to Sefton, Canterbury, NZ
Hannah b. 1844
Thomas b. 1846
John b. 1849 - emigrated to Australia
Jonathan b. 1852

So this seems to confirm your present belief. My contact (Margaret) laughed when she provided the detail saying, in effect, Yes, I know about (the Vaughns but) I'm having enough trouble with the Irish Gilberts...

You would have presumably come across the many and varied comments about the why, of the scarcity of Irish records for one reason or another; the census records were destroyed by the British during WW1 in their search for paper to support the war effort; the records were destroyed by the (republicans) during the Civil War... Anyhoo, what one does find one is suitably grateful for.

So we are 'cousins' through Jane and James, children of Thomas and Sarah Gilbert.
I've learnt something and I thank you, however, this is all I can offer you in the meantime.

If you do not know the site, Google 'Ted Marr's family tree'; it will come straight up. Evidently the work of many years, it's amazing.
I don't know how many surnames are on there but, as descendant of a Gilbert, you will be (loosely connected) to all of them.
Mr Marr may go back maybe one generation earlier than Thomas Gilbert but likely there will be an indicative date only against the name, without further detail. Most of the names on the site do explain who the individuals were and is very informative.

Thanks for the heads up, I will have a look at ancestry.com.

Regards
David

kiwias
09-11-2013, 11:03 AM
Hi Shelagh

Ancestry site - probably not holding my mouth right, can you give me a link, please.

Oh, BTB, the letter writer in 1892 was John Wycliffe Gilbert, died in 1893.
His will refers to:
Mother Anne Gilbert, brothers William Anderson Gilbert and sister Catherine Jane.

He's living with 'Aunt Vaughn', Uncles Richard and Jonathan (Thomas Vaughn, the principal, is one executor, the other is brother William.)
Annie b. 1807 is a daughter of Thomas and Sarah Gilbert, Richard and Jonathan Gilbert would certainly be uncles. Thomas Vaughn would be a brother in law.

cheers
David

kiwias
11-11-2013, 7:29 AM
Hi Shelagh

I found the story of John Furphy (you spelt it correctly), 1842-1920. on the Australian Dictionery of Biography site.
Says he was born at Moonee Ponds, Victoria. I thought 'Moonee Ponds' was some place made up by Dame Edna Everidge. I didn't realise it was 'real'. Oh dear. :)

I don't know what you know but don't want to bother you with stuff you already do.

From the NZ side, here 's John Vaughan, b. 1849, from the Cyclopedia of NZ, c. 1902.
(no wonder there was a dearth of info to start; I was typing in 'Vaughn')
He did go to Australia but four years later came over to NZ.

Vaughan, John, Farmer, “Pine View,” Cheviot. Mr. Vaughan was born in County Armagh, Ireland, in 1849, was educated at Portadown, and trained as a farmer. He came out to Victoria in the ship “Somersetshire” in 1869, and after four years crossed the Tasman Sea and joined his late brother, William, at Sefton; he subsequently managed his brother's business at Waikari for fourteen years. In 1893 Mr. Vaughan purchased “Pine View,” then 100 acres in extent, to which he has since added 106 acres; he conducts mixed farming, and grazes a fine flock of sheep. Mr. Vaughan was placed on the commission of the peace in 1894, and is treasurer to the Cheviot County Settlers' Association and a member of the local school committee. He is married, and has one son and one daughter.

Our colonial-era newspapers are at paperspast.natlib.govt.nz
Click on 'Canterbury' and then choose one; maybe the Press. Searching for the name 'William Vaughan' brings up about 550 hits.
I tend to start with Births, Deaths and Marriages, as they give one names to go by.William's wife is variously named 'Jane' or 'Jeanie' in the birth notices. They lost at least two children at a very young age. Williams general store business is notified for sale or lease in the Press of 19 Feb 1897, so he died a little prior this date.

Is the John Vaughan you've been in touch with, connected with a University of Waikato website, NZ-Ireland Connection? If so, I found this today, myself, and have sent him an email. If it's the same guy, he'll know all this (basic) stuff already.

cheers
David Boyd

Sheel
11-11-2013, 11:37 PM
Hi David
Lots of good info to add to my books. My old computer died and with it a lot of email contacts, including John Vaughan's so I'm not sure of his current work/connections. However, as I mentioned before he is keen on family tree research so you have probably hit the nail on the head there. Lovely to learn of more distant cousins across the ditch. I'm keen to try and track back earlier Vaughan/Gilbert history The earliest I have been able to find is William Vaughan (1805)'s father also William Vaughan - born 1762 died 1/2/1847 @ Seagoe. His wife's name was Hannah but other than that we have no details. Their children were Ann, born 1794, Rachael born 1797, George born 1800-1828, Hannah born 1801-1845 and William of course b 1805 d 5/8/1886 @ Seagoe. So steadily putting together the pieces of the puzzle

Regards Shelagh

kiwias
14-11-2013, 6:38 AM
Hi Shelagh

You've just given me an extra generation of Vaughans.
On Saturday, my local co-researcher gave me the names William and Hannah. Not known if she knows more, but I feel unlikely; as well as the names of William and Jane's children. I now also know that children Sarah and John went to Australia - the latter crossing to NZ for while - whilst William went to Canterbury.
I was explaining to our Irish friend, the comparative ease locally, of sourcing information from those times, especially if a colonist was in business, or on a local body, or had the money to pay for an advertisement concerning births, deaths and marriages. A cursory search for William Vaughan on our paperspast site (think Trove, but much better) provided BDM info, court cases he was involved in, and such like. I assume this is all known to you?

Obviously, as I was unknown to him, I asked John Vaughan of Upper Hutt (Wellington) if he could advise in general terms (briefly) what his connection was with the Vaughan families in the South Island. He graciously replied with 1 1/2 A4 pages :)
He stopped when he decided that it was getting too long and boring. No, go on, go on!
He says he is 'pretty well retired now, from the family business'.
Would this be your John Vaughan?

Mine of Nov 10: Annie b. 1807 is a daughter of Thomas and Sarah Gilbert, Richard and Jonathan Gilbert would certainly be uncles. Thomas Vaughn would be a brother in law. Can't find the email presently. 'Ireland' says I got this wrong. Thomas Vaughan would be a cousin?

It would appear that the Gilbert link with the Vaughan's starts and finishes with young Jane. I could send you some family trees if you wish. Notwithstanding, these Irish connections turn up all sorts of interesting things, such as the fact that, over one hundred years of inter-marriage, I am actually related to my wife through marriage. What are the odds of that. I couldn't believe it. And who said all this family tree stuff was boring?

cheers
David

godzone
15-11-2013, 2:50 AM
Correction, Shelagh - the Vaughan / Gilbert connection does not end with 'young Jane.'

In a diary for the year 1896, Mary Elizabeth (Minnie) Gilbert, daughter of James and Eliza Jane Gilbert, of Auckland, has
written the address of a Mrs Furphy, Vaughan-ville, Shepperton, Victoria, Australia.
Evidently they corresponded.

A comment from my local co-researcher is that her grandfather, Stephen Gilbert, son of James and Eliza, visited 'the Vaughans'
in Australia, after his marriage.
The fact that another son, Thomas, also visited the Vaughan's is established by Vaughan acknowledgement of
Thomas' death, as in, Sorry to hear; we enjoyed his visit(s) with us.

So… there definitely was contact between the Gilberts of Auckland and their extended Vaughan relations
in Victoria.

Amazing.

cheers
David

Sheel
15-11-2013, 9:44 AM
This stuff is NEVER boring just completely frustrating. lol. I have found finding the Vaughans/Furphy records in Oz comparatively easy - but from my perspective, as yours, they are distant cousins, we all sharing common ancestor of William Vaughan and Jane Gilbert. As you mentioned in earlier post, the destruction of so many Irish records has proved to be the bane of all us with Irish ancestry. Firstly John Vaughan, Upper Hutt is also descended from William Vaughan. It has been a few years since we have exchanged emails. If you know how to private message in this forum ( I don't!) I will give you my email to make sending of tree transcripts etc. easier. One of these days I will head across the ditch and will be great to catch up with all these cousins I have just discovered, lol.
I work in a school and holidays are almost upon us, so during the extended break, I will attempt some more Parish enquiries to see what Vaughan/Gilbert records exist still. Once I get your email address, I should be able to email an invite to my ancestry tree, where you can see what info I have, so far, on this branch of the family. Happy researching
Shelagh :-)