JONES

[LindaJenkins]

Hello, I am looking for the Jones side of my family and maybe more.

My grandmother was Lilian May Jones Sept 1905 - May 1991

Her parents were John William Jones no date of birth or death. Although I have been told that he died fairly young. He was a coal foreman in Cardiff docks. His wife was given a job as a cook at the docks after his death.

Lilian's mother was Eliza Ann Jones born about 1878 possibly in Dinas Powis and died 1957.

Eliza was the 3rd of four children. She had an older brother and sister. She also had a younger brother named Alfie who died of shell shock in the 20's.

Eliza worked in what my Aunt refered to as the big house in Dinas Powis. There she was the children's nurse. Her mother was the Laundress and her father was the gardener all at the big house.

I have no idea what most of that means, unfortunately. Any information to enlighten me would be much appreciated. I am looking for Eliza Ann's maiden name as well as her parents names. And any more information on John William Jones would be appreciated also.

Thanks so much!
Linda

[Kerrywood]

This was posted in the Surname Interests forum, where threads are automatically closed.

As Linda is requesting responses I've moved it here instead, so that members can reply.

[LindaJenkins]

This was posted in the Surname Interests forum, where threads are automatically closed.

As Linda is requesting responses I've moved it here instead, so that members can reply.

Thank you as I was not as observant as I should have been =(

[olliecat]

Hello, I am looking for the Jones side of my family and maybe more.

My grandmother was Lilian May Jones Sept 1905 - May 1991


Hello Linda :smile5:

Jones being such a common name, perhaps you could fill us in on a few more details. You mentioned you don't know Eliza Ann's maiden name, so I gather you don't have Lilian's birth certificate. Could you tell us where Lilian was born? Do you have her death certificate - which should give her exact date and place of birth? Sorry for so many questions?

I had a quick look just now in the 1911 census and after some random choosing found a family living in Cardiff, father John William JONES, mother Eliza Ann, daughter Lillian May (born abt 1906 Cardiff) and daughter Daisy.
1911: RG/PN32117 SN29

This is rather a shot in the dark though as I'm not sure from your post exactly where Lilian was born and if she had any siblings.

[malcolm99]

It looks as though John William Jones married Eliza Ann Collier in Cardiff Registration District in the March Quarter of 1903. Vol. 11a Page 486.

It is possible to buy an official copy of this certificate.

[christanel]

Info already posted

[christanel]

The info already posted.

[LindaJenkins]

Hello Linda :smile5:

Jones being such a common name, perhaps you could fill us in on a few more details. You mentioned you don't know Eliza Ann's maiden name, so I gather you don't have Lilian's birth certificate. Could you tell us where Lilian was born. Do you have her death certificate - which should give her exact date and place of birth? Sorry for so many questions?

I had a quick look just now in the 1911 census and after some random choosing found a family living in Cardiff, father John William JONES, mother Eliza Ann, daughter Lillian May (born abt 1906 Cardiff) and daughter Daisy.
1911: RG/PN32117 SN29

This is a shot in the dark though as I'm not sure from your post exactly where Lilian was born and if she had any siblings.

Yes she had a sister named Daisy. She also had a brother named Alfie who died when he was about 8.
Lilian was born 25 Sept 1905 and died 4 May 1991 in Southampton. I am assuming she was born in Cardiff.

Thanks!

[malcolm99]

On the 1901 Census there is:

Sarah Collier, a widow, age 49, occupation – laundress; born in Gillingham in Dorset (that’s in the south-west of England).
Eliza A Collier, unmarried, age 23, occupation – laundress; born in Trevethin, Monmouthshire

The Dynas Powis connection is that their address is 6, Chamberlain Row, St Andrew, Dynas Powis, Glamorganshire.

[Census ref: RG13 piece 4996 folio 51 page 10. Record in care of TNA: Crown copyright].

[Mutley]

Following on from the shot in the dark,
John William Jones in 1901 may have been living at 50 Pearl Street, Roath.
RG13/4975 / 32 / 55 (Record in care of TNA: Crown copyright)
He was born in 1874 in Cardiff and was a coal weigher

[olliecat]

Lilian was born 25 Sept 1905 and died 4 May 1991 in Southampton. I am assuming she was born in Cardiff.


The only birth I can find in 1905 in the Cardiff registration district is this one.

Births Dec 1905 Cardiff 11A 323
JONES Lilian May

If you decide to order the certificate I would recommend you specify her parents' names. Then you won't have to pay for the certificate if the details do not match. I would also recommend you go through the Cardiff register office rather than the GRO, since you can be more flexible with the parent's names (i.e. ask then to check for both Eliza/John and Eliza Ann/John William combinations.) The last time I used the Cardiff register office, they were both helpful and quick.

[LindaJenkins]

On the 1901 Census there is:

Sarah Collier, a widow, age 49, occupation – laundress; born in Gillingham in Dorset (that’s in the south-west of England).
Eliza A Collier, unmarried, age 23, occupation – laundress; born in Trevethin, Monmouthshire

The Dynas Powis connection is that their address is 6, Chamberlain Row, St Andrew, Dynas Powis, Glamorganshire.

[Census ref: RG13 piece 4996 folio 51 page 10. Record in care of TNA: Crown copyright].

Sounds like a good possibility. So much info to digest. Thanks!

[LindaJenkins]

The only birth I can find in 1905 in the Cardiff registration district is this one.

Births Dec 1905 Cardiff 11A 323
JONES Lilian May

If you decide to order the certificate I would recommend you specify her parents names. This means you get your money back if it is not a match. I would also recommend you go through the Cardiff register office rather than the GRO, since you can be more flexible with the parent's names (i.e. ask then to check for both Eliza/John and Eliza Ann/John William combinations.) The last time I used the Cardiff register office, they were both helpful and quick.

Thanks for that info. I DO know that her birthdate/death date are correct. My mother and Lilian's daughter confirmed that. Thanks for the head up on asking for specific parents. I plan to run all the information past my Aunt Ceinwen and see if any of it strikes a cord and brings back a memory.

Thanks!

[olliecat]

Thanks for that info. I DO know that her birthdate/death date are correct.

If Lilian was born toward the end of September then she may have been registered in October or even November (you had up to six weeks to register a birth.) Just in case you are not aware of this, but for the birth posted above, Dec means the December quarter, i.e. the birth was registered in October, November or December but we don't know exactly when by just looking at the index. So, for a birth on the 25 Sep 1905, the birth in the index is a reasonable match.

However, since you know Lilian's exact date of birth, in your shoes I would send an email to the Cardiff register office and give them this information along with her parents' names. They don't use the GRO indexes and will check using their own system. :smile:

[olliecat]

Eliza was the 3rd of four children. She had an older brother and sister. She also had a younger brother named Alfie who died of shell shock in the 20's.

Eliza worked in what my Aunt refered to as the big house in Dinas Powis. There she was the children's nurse. Her mother was the Laundress and her father was the gardener all at the big house.


Working from the 1901 census as posted by Malcolm, a possibility in the 1881 census ...

1881: Piece: 5254; Folio: 58; Page: 23 (crown copyright, care of the TNA)
Spring Terrace, Pontypool
COLLIER, Alfred 30, labourer in a coal mine, Wiltshire
COLLIER, Sarah 30, Dorset
COLLIER, James 7, Cwmbran, Monmouthshire
COLLIER, Edith 6, Cwmbran
COLLIER, Ann 4, Cwmbran
COLLIER, Alfred 2, Cwmbran

1891: RG12; Piece: 4405; Folio 54; Page 12 (crown copyright, care of the TNA)
Morning Side House, St Andrews and Dinas Powis, Glamorgan
Eliza Ann Collier, domestic servant, Cwmbran Monmouthshire
Note: (Many others are in the household and the head is named William Edward Jayne

Now need to find mum Sarah and the rest of them the 1891 census.

Edit: Must leave Mutley to find the Jones side of the family - since this is of course much easier. :devil:

[olliecat]

Now need to find mum Sarah and the rest of them the 1891 census.


One more for you before I depart for some sleep.

1891: RG12; Piece: 4365; Folio 67; Page 2 (crown copyright, care of the TNA)
Pontnewydd, Monmouthshire
COLLIER, Sarah 40, wid, Gillingham, Dorset
COLLIER, James 16, engine tender, Llanfrechfa, Mon
COLLIER, Edith 15, char girl, Llanfrechfa
COLLIER, Alfred 11, Llanfrechfa

Note: Cwmbran and Llanfrechfa are quite close and so the birth places are reasonably consistent with the 1881 census.

Surname transcribed as CODIER on Ancestry and FMP.

[LindaJenkins]

One more for you before I depart for some sleep.

1891: RG12; Piece: 4365; Folio 67; Page 2 (crown copyright, care of the TNA)
Pontnewydd, Monmouthshire
COLLIER, Sarah 40, wid, Gillingham, Dorset
COLLIER, James 16, engine tender, Llanfrechfa, Mon
COLLIER, Edith 15, char girl, Llanfrechfa
COLLIER, Alfred 11, Llanfrechfa

Note: Cwmbran and Llanfrechfa are quite close and so the birth places are reasonably consistent with the 1881 census.

Surname transcribed as CODIER on Ancestry and FMP.

Thanks! You are GREAT!

[LindaJenkins]

Surname transcribed as CODIER on Ancestry and FMP.

Brilliant! I would have never caught that! Thanks so much! :)

[Mutley]

Edit: Must leave Mutley to find the Jones side of the family - since this is of course much easier. :devil:

Sorry not be able to get on~line
but I will look or at least I'll try,
Amanha!

[LindaJenkins]

Sorry not be able to get on~line
but I will look or at least I'll try,
Amanha!

Thanks Mutley! :)

[barbara lee]

Hello Linda

I have a "nostalgia" book on 19th century Dinas Powys, and one picture shows the big house called Morningside, one of two built after 1885 to attract the wealthy. The other was called Rockside. I will PM you, and if you give me your e-mail address I will send you a scan of the picture.

Barbara