JOHN JOSHUA JONAS -AARON-CRAWCOUR LINKS

[phillip]

This post links to the Catherine Aaron postings and the marriage between Celia Jonas and Moses Aaron son of Aaron Aarons and Catherine Crawcour.Following further research records show the following:
John Joshua Jonas b 1796 ( son of Israel Jonas and Leah) married Elizabeth Hannah Gomme daughter of William Gomme and Elizabeth Buss.
Free BMD records the death of Elizabeth Hannah Jonas March quarter 1864 Bethnal Green 1c 227 and there is the possible death of John Jonas June Quarter 1854 Barnet 3a 67.
John and Elizabeth had several children including:
Eliza Margaret b 1838;Alfred Charles b 1841-1933; Elizabeth Leah 1844-1844; Caroline Sophia 1823;Edward James 1825;Celia Rebecca 1828;Edward James 1825; Louisa Augusta 1832- there maybe others but all these children appear in the Baptism Records of St Matthew Bethnal Green Middlesex but several at a much later date then when they were born. John Joshua also appears in the Baptism record June 5 1831 although his record shows he was born 7 Jan 1796.
There was a mass baptism of 5 of the family on the same day.
John's occupation on the baptisms shows his abode for the baptism of Celia as Chatham and his trade Green Grocer. When Louisa Augusta was baptised in 1832 John's occupation is Cordwainer and he is at Pilgrims Place.
When John Joshua was baptised his parents were given as Israel Jonas and Leah. His father's abode Alie St and his trade was Chapman.
I will post more data on the lines including various census records.
Phillip

[phillip]

In my earlier posting I gave data on the Baptisms of the Jonas family but interestingly John Joshua still retained his family Jewish links. The 1841 Census ( Crown Copyright, TNA) H0107 692 3 shows at Hebrew Girl's School Louisa Jonas 10; Caroline Jonas 16; Celia Jonas 12.
In 1851 Eliza Margaret Jonas 13 is a boarder at the Hebrew Girl's Boarding School Palestine Place.
In 1861 census ( Crown copyright,TNA) RG9 257
7 West Strret Bethnal Green
Samuel Jackson H M 36 Brass and Iron Bedstead Maker b Lancashire
Louisa wife 24 b Bethnal Green
Elizabeth Jonas Widow Boarder 62 b St George East
Caroline Jonas dau U 36 b St George East
Eliza Jonas dau U 22 Upholsterer
Lewis Tiddyman M 36 brother in law Iron Bedstead Maker b Bethan Green
Celia wife 32 b Whitechapel
Alfred son 5 scholar b Bethnal Green
Nb This record indicates John Joshua Jonas was dead .
There is the marriage of Louis Tiddyman labourer to Celia Rebecca Jonas on 14 July 1856 at St Peter's Church Bethnal Green.
There is also the marriage on 21 July 1856 between Samuel Jackson and Louisa Augusta Jonas. Samuel was a Smith.
Phillip

[phillip]

Having re- checked the earlier Catherine Aaron( s) postings there was reference to Celia Jonas who married Moses Aaron Sept Quarter 1860 St James 1a 763 as being related to John Joshua Jonas. The data was never 'fleshed out' in the posting but it appears from the records cited in the original postings and in these subsequent postings that Celia Rebecca Jonas daughter of John Joshua Jonas and the Celia Jonas who married Moses Aaron are not one in the same.
The marriage of Celia Rebecca Jonas to Louis Tiddyman in 1856 and a citing of her death in 1879 Strand does not match that of Celia Jonas and Moses Aaron. There is the death in March quarter 1886 Marylebone 1a 518 of Celia Aarons and the 1881 census shows Moses and Celia.
In addition, Celia Rebecca was born in 1828 and the other Celia in circa 1823.

Unless I am misreading the evidence it appears that the Celia Jonas who married Moses Aaron is the the daughter of another Jonas but not John Joshua Jonas.

If anyone can support my findings ( I can't see the death of Celia Tiddyman/Tiedmann/Tidyman - the family names was spelt differently over time) in 1879 but irrespective of her death she can't be the same person who married Moses. I have not checked the census records for Celia and Louis but am I right in thinking she is with Louis post 1856 and Moses and Celia are together up until 1881.

Does anyone have any views on who Celia Jonas's parents were?
Phillip

[Kerrywood]

interestingly John Joshua still retained his family Jewish links. The 1841 Census ( Crown Copyright, TNA) H0107 692 3 shows at Hebrew Girl's School Louisa Jonas 10; Caroline Jonas 16; Celia Jonas 12.
In 1851 Eliza Margaret Jonas 13 is a boarder at the Hebrew Girl's Boarding School Palestine Place.

This is the same school in 1841 (H0107/692 book 3 folio 16 page 25) and 1851 (HO107/1540 folio 605 page 39). Please provide full census references -- see our guidelines (http://www.british-genealogy.com/forums/showthread.php/53268-Census-look-ups-PLEASE-READ).

Palestine Place was not a Jewish school actually, but was run by a Christian missionary society dedicated to the conversion of Jews.

from
www.
aim25.ac.uk/cgi-bin/vcdf/detail?coll_id=3975&inst_id=23&nv1=search&nv2 ...
[The site was] leased in 1811 by William Sotheby to the London Society for Promoting Christianity amongst the Jews. The site was renamed Palestine Place and became the centre of the Society's activities in London. The foundation stone of a Chapel (later known as the Episcopal Jews Chapel) was laid in 1813 and in the following years schools for boys and girls and 14 houses were built.

Plenty of other online references too.

[Kerrywood]

1871 census
RG10/361 folio 9 page 12
9 Bull Inn Court, St Martin in the Fields
Lewis Tidyman Head Mar 47 Blacksmith born Whitechapel
Celia Tidyman Wife Mar 42 born Hackney
Edward Tidyman Son 8 Scholar born Hackney
Florence Tidyman Daur 5 Scholar born Hackney
Adelaide Tidyman Daur 3 born Hackney

(record held by TNA, Crown copyright)

Deaths
Dec Qtr 1879
TEDYMAN Celia 45
Strand vol 1b page 459

The parish register for the 1856 marriage to Louis TIDDYMAN confirms Celia Rebecca's father as John Joshua JONAS, Gentleman.

[Kerrywood]

This could be the AARONS couple who married in 1860 ...

1861 census
RG9/135 folio 107 page 23
17 Arthur Terrace, Islington
Masco Aaram Head Mar 32 Furniture dealer born London Strand
Selica Aaram Wife Mar 28 born London St Georges East
(separate schedule, same dwelling)
Henry Thos Jonas Head Mar 31 Letter Sorter Genl Post Office born Devon Honiton
Elizabeth Jonas Wife Mar 33 born Devon Honiton
Harry Jonas Son 2 born London Islington
Ellen Jonas Daur 6 Sch born London Holborn

(record held by TNA, Crown copyright)

Looking further ...

[Kerrywood]

1871 census
RG10/226 folio 65 page 11
117 Ossulston Street, Somers Town, St Pancras
John M Aaron Head Mar 42 Furniture Dealer born Strand
Selecia? Aaron Wife Mar 40 born St Georges in the East
Aaron Lewis Aaron Son 9 born Islington
Rachael Abrahams Niece 7 born St Pancras
Emily Cory Servt Unm 40? born St Pancras

(record held by TNA, Crown copyright)

[Kerrywood]

1881 census
RG11/148 folio 54 page 20
84 Crawford Street, Marylebone
Thomas Aaron Head 50 Furniture Dealer born Middlesex Bethnal Green
Selia Aaron Wife 50 born Middlesex Somers Town
Lewis Aaron Son Unm 19 Furniture Dealer born Middlesex Islington
Rachael Abrahams Niece Unm 17 Feather Business born Middlesex St Pancras
Rachael Cainton? Servt 14 Genl Domestic Servt born Middlesex Shoreditch

(record held by TNA, Crown copyright)

So in conclusion, the Celias are two different people, since we have both couples in 1871, the death of Celia TEDYMAN in 1879, and the AARONS wife still alive in 1881 -- always assuming the census findings are correct.

Finding Celia JONAS with parents before the 1860 marriage is proving difficult ...

[phillip]

My thanks Kerry for your research. I was hoping that my distant relative Steve Fenn who is descended from Moses Aaron and Celia Jonas would submit details of the marriage certificate of Moses and Celia. This would give us the name of her father.
I have also been looking on my paid site plus Free BMD for details of the marriage of Henry Thomas Jonas who you gave data on in 1861. I can't see a marriage for a Henry Jonas and an Elizabeth between 1850-1865 except for the marriage of Henry Jonas Dec Quarter 1849 9 633 Totnes. There is no Elizabeth linked to the marriage and the children Harry and Ellen were born long after 1849.
It maybe just a coincidence that they shared the same surname as Celia but it is sensible to consider that they may also be related.

Although Moses Aaron ( Aarons) parents were Jews ( Aaron Aarons and Catherine 'Kitty' Crawcour) there is no reason to assume he married a Jew and the Jonas surname is applicable to both Jews and non Jews.
I can't locate a Celia Jonas on my site who fits the age of the wife of Moses Aaron.
Phillip

[Kerrywood]

The marriage to Moses AARON might have been a second one? I'm still working on that ...

[Kerrywood]

I can't see a marriage for a Henry Jonas and an Elizabeth between 1850-1865 except for the marriage of Henry Jonas Dec Quarter 1849 9 633 Totnes. There is no Elizabeth linked to the marriage and the children Harry and Ellen were born long after 1849.
I think he may really be Henry Thomas JONES, which is how he appears in 1871, still in Islington and with the same wife and children.
RG10-266 folio 59 page 11 (reference to record held by TNA)

So possibly a red herring.

Steve Fenn might see your post tonight, if he is signed up to email alerts from the forum.

[Kerrywood]

Steve Fenn might see your post tonight, if he is signed up to email alerts from the forum.

And if not, you could perhaps send him a PM.