Did my great nan/grand-dad adopt a child

[barbie]

I have got the 1911 census of my great nan/grand-dad, Thomas and Eliza (Eleanor) Cubbins and they were in their 50's and my grand-dad, Frederick was 10 years old. I notice that there is a 7 months old baby, Ethel with no surname or where she was born and says adopted. Does this mean they adopted the baby or their baby was adopted? Bear in mind they were in their 50's. Hope someone can help. Thanks |help|

[Geoffers]

The census records those actually residing at the address on the night of the census (see details in the printed column above the names). So Ethel was with this family then.

Looking at the entry RG14/21929 SN118 (reference to census in care of TNA) - I read this as being the adopted daughter of Thomas CUBBINS.

Could Ethel have been the child of one of their elder children not shown on the 1911 census in this schedule? (Sadly no birthplace is given for Ethel).

When Thomas died, did he leave a will in which he mentions her?

[grisel]

Hi
There is a marriage in freeBMD 1930 Jun Q Birkenhead of an Ethel Cubbins which could be her. Of course she may give her adopted father Thomas as her father on the cert which wouldn't get you any further forward.

[barbie]

I am not very good at this sort of thing. I only got the 1911 census the other night and seen that about ethel. I did think it could have been one of their children's child cos most of them were in their teen and early 20's. My granddad, Fred was the youngest and 10 years old. I never knew my grandparents so I don't know much about them really.
Are you on about Thomas my great grand-dad or his son thomas, Fred's brother as they have a son with that name. soz about me not understanding.

[Mutley]

I wonder if she was Edith's child? Edith was stated as married but still using the name Cubbins. There is a marriage for Edith Cubbins to George Downes on 23 Jan 1911 so she should have been Edith Downes.
And where was George, I wonder?

[barbie]

grisel, hope you don't mind me asking, how do you get to see it free cos when i do it i always seem to have to pay. Thanks

[barbie]

Soz for being slow and getting lost here. I'll catch up with you lol

[barbie]

Hi mutley, long time no hear. Well hope you remember me lol. I think Edith's hubby could have been in the army or hospital or something like that. Also we are not sure if she married a george downes or william edwards. I wonder why she not used her married surname either. Need to do some deep digging now lol

[Geoffers]

Are you on about Thomas my great grand-dad or his son thomas, Fred's brother as they have a son with that name. soz about me not understanding.

If you mean my reference to a will, I was thinking for Thomas who is the head of household in the 1911 census - Ethel's adoptive father.

[grisel]

grisel, hope you don't mind me asking, how do you get to see it free cos when i do it i always seem to have to pay. Thanks

Hope Ive done the quote correctly!

Free BMD is a free site. You can google it. If you click search then look for marriages wth name Ethel Cubbins only one record comes up which is the one above. Hope you find it. Things are always confusing at first.

[Mutley]

Hello again, yes I remember Cubbins and MacMurray. |wave|

Marriages that are on FreeBMD (http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/cgi/search.pl) do not give much information. You need to buy the certificate.

Some of the pay per view sites have Parish Records.

The marriage of Edith Cubbins was at St. Mark, New Ferry, Cheshire on 23 Jan 1911.
Edith was 20 and George was 22. Her father was Thomas and his was Richard.

[barbie]

ah, done it now. When I did it before, it took me to ancestry with a padlock. Many thanks for that

[barbie]

Glad you remember me, i am getting a little further now with the family info but really slow. I have been taking a break cos I felt if I kept searching my brain was getting cloudy and couldn't get anywhere. I start again a few weeks or months later and get a little further then it goes all cloudy again. I am strange aren't I lol. Getting back to it now, I will prob have to take a chance on paying for the wed certifcate on edith cubbins marriage to george downes and yet, we heard she was married to william edwards altho my eldest sister has heard the surname downes mention many years ago. So (sigh) we don't know who she married for deffo.

[susan-y]

Perhaps George Downes died and she then married William Edwards.

Sue

[barbie]

Will have to check that one out ,thanks sue. Thanks. Getting back to what I was asking about Ethel, I notice Emma Cubbins (about 24 yrs old) was living as a live in domestic servant somewhere else (Thomas/Eliza's daughter) but Eliza, their other daughter (age about 22 years old) is not there and I can't find her in the census 1911. Do you think she could have died and had a child and Thomas/Eliza adopted the child or poss Eliza got married and was living somewhere else. What should I do next? Thanks

[barbie]

Thank you mutley, how did you get all that info. If I was to order the marriage certificate, will it then have Edith's Mum name on it, cos I think that will finalised it if she is our family? I notice in them days nearly everyone had the same names even some families and can never tell which are our family. I know after a few head bashing figuring it out you suss it out but gosh its hard. I mean, I started off not knowing anything about my mum but gradually getting further now. I must say it does help coming on here but I can't expect everyone to do all the work for me can I really lol

[Mutley]

I cannot find a record anywhere of a Cubbins or Downes marriage to an Edwards. I have searched on the Free BMD site, Ancestry and Find my Past.

The additional information on the marriage certificate for Edith to George will only give you the occupations of the fathers not any details of the mothers. The mother's name is on a birth certificate only.

Little Ethel could be the daughter of any of the elder kids of Thomas and Eliza, grandparents often took on their child's offspring, especially then, prior to official adoption. She could also be the daughter of a neighbour, friend or of Eliza's family. At the moment it is difficult to know.

In this time frame all you can do is try to follow each member of the family and hope for a clue along the way. Maybe you are young enough that the next census will reveal all. ;)

The marriage of Ethel Cubbins was to either Arthur Bell or William Davies. That certificate would tell you the name of the person Ethel thinks is her father or there will be a big empty space if she does not know.

Good Luck