Bigamist?

[Hils Hoppo]

My Great Aunt Sophia Walls married Ludolf Withowski in Hastings in 1867 but he is on the 1851 census living in Hertford married to Amelia Small. In 1869 he pops up in Eastbourne marrying Annie Woodhall! I'm sure this is one and the same person as the name is so unusual and the dates of birth match. I can't find death certificates for either Amelia or Sophia that suggest he was twice widowed. Is it possible he divorced his first two wives or do we have a bigamist in the family?

[AdeleE]

Here's one death registration:

Name: Sophia Witkowski
Est birth year: abt 1830
Year: 1868
Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec
Age: 38
District: Eastbourne
County: Sussex, East Sussex
Volume: 2b
Page: 37

[Jules]

Hi, just to make things worse, there is a Ludolf Witkowski b. 1829 London (upholsterer) on the 1871 in Eastbourne married to a Jane, with 2 children aged 17, and 9 months,

Wow he gets about.

Jules

[djamb]

Possibly another -not sure though


Name: Amelia Witkowski
Year of Registration: 1855
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: Hertford
County: Hertfordshire
Volume: 3a

[Jules]

In 1891 Lewdolf Witkowski b. 1830 London, living alone but listed as married, occupation: living on own means, in Wantage, Berks.

[Jules]

In 1881 Lewdolf Witteowski b. 1828 London, still living with Jane and 5 children now in Halstead, Essex.

[Jules]

I think he married Jane in 1869 and not Annie Woodall. The marriage record only lists 3 people instead of 4, the missing name must be Jane.

Edmund Caton
Ludolf Withowski
Annie Woodall

There is an Edmund Caten married to an Annie with a 6 month old daughter in the 1871.

[djamb]

There is a marriage of a

Jane CARVER

1869 Q4
Eastbourne vol 2b pg 125

Which matches the same marriage details of the other three.

[JAP1]

So all is straightforward; no divorces, not a bigamist - just a chap who was twice widowed.

I haven't yet found him and his son Ludolf jnr in the 1861 census; his presumed daughter Amelia Ann is at boarding school.

In 1841 Ludolph (transcribed by Ancestry as Luddph WISKOWSKI), age 15, born F, is in the household of a School Master in Hertfordshire - HO107/ Piece 444/ Book 14/ Hertingfordbury Hertfordshire/ ED 8/ Folio 10/ Page 14 (Crown Copyright, held at TNA)

From the IGI:
* WITKOWSKI, Ludolf, b 12 Jul bap 29 Jul 1827, St James Westminster London, parents Valentin WITKOWSKI & Mary
* WITKOWSKI, Valentin Joseph, bap 21 Aug 1828, St James Westminster London, parents Valentin WITKOWSKI & Mary Ann
* WITKOWSKI, Lewdolf, b 26 Oct 1828, bap 4 Jan 1829, St James Westminster London, parents Valentin WITKOWSKI & Mary Ann

Burials from the London Parish Registers:
St Luke Chelsea, Middlesex
* Ludolph WITKOWSKI (3 entries), Sloane Street, age 3 weeks, 8 Aug 1827, Convulsions
* Valentin WITKOWSKI (2 entries), Sloane Street, age 44, 2 Apr 1828, Bursting of Blood Vessell
Parish of Ealing, Middlesex
* Valentin Joseph WITKOWSKI, Ealing, age 10, 24 Sep 1835

JAP

[Hils Hoppo]

Thanks everyone for all that info - I'm going to need a while to take it all in! Obviously you've all gained all this from websites other than the one I'm using - which incidentally I'm not re-newing my subscription to this year! Thanks again!

[JAP1]

Hi Hils Hoppo,

Some of the information on this thread comes from Ancestry.
If you are using Ancestry and can't find the information, please ask.

But far far from all is from Ancestry!

There is information from the following free sites:

* www.familysearch.org (the IGI and the 1881 England census)
and
* http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ (BMD entries for England)

I have not checked out whether there are any relevant entries on FreeCEN or FreeREG.

Enjoy!

JAP

[Hils Hoppo]

Thanks to you all! I've now had the time to sort through all this and can't understand why a lot of these entries haven't emerged for me on Ancestry, even though I've ticked the 'varients' boxes. Anyway I've now got it sorted and it appears that Ludolf wasn't a bigamist, although I think he may have been a bit of a bounder who put himself around a bit!

He appears to have been married to Amelia in Hertfordshire (they lived with her mother who gives her occupation as 'Lady' - was there money in the family I ask?) and probably had a son Ludolf jnr.in 1854. Amelia dies in 1855 and he moves to Hastings in Kent where he marries my Gt Aunt Sophia in1867. She dies just one year later at the age of 38 and within a year he has married Jane in Eastbourne, East Sussex. They have 6 children and move to Halstead in Essex. Ten years later on the 1991 census he pops up in Wantage Oxfordshire stating that he is 'unmarried'. I don't think wife number three died on him as I've found a death reg for her in 1914 in Headington Oxfordshire.

I'm sure he is one and the same person as the birth year and occupation are consistant. I'm going to be ordering his wives death certificates to check just how they died!!

Thanks again!|hug|

[Hils Hoppo]

I've just 'googled' Ludolf and found him in someone's family tree with all 3 of his wives included. Apparently his grandfather was Count Orlando Witkowski from Poland - so what was he doing marrying my gt aunt Sophia a mere servant girl?!!

The thick plottens!;)

[Geoffers]

I've just 'googled' Ludolf and found him in someone's family tree with all 3 of his wives included. Apparently his grandfather was Count Orlando Witkowski from Poland - so what was he doing marrying my gt aunt Sophia a mere servant girl?!!

Does the record say he was a Count, or does it say that he was supposed to be a count?

If it says he was - Was his dad definitely a Count, or did he just claim to be?

All that appears on the internet is not necessarily accurate, some people claim noble ancestry and in fact have made a mistake.

Is it definitely the same person?

[Hils Hoppo]

Does the record say he was a Count, or does it say that he was supposed to be a count?

If it says he was - Was his dad definitely a Count, or did he just claim to be?

All that appears on the internet is not necessarily accurate, some people claim noble ancestry and in fact have made a mistake.

Is it definitely the same person?

I'm sure it is the same person as the birth date is correct plus he has all 3 wives listed. His grandfather is given as Count Orlando Witkowski - but I've no idea if tha's been authenticated or not. He apparently originated from Poland but then anyone could call themselves a Count without actually being nobility - so I have my doubts.

One other interesting thing I noticed is the owner of the tree has the death of Amelia down as his daughter Amelia not his wife. In which case he was still married when he married my Gt Aunt Sophia! I've emailed him to check this out.

[Hils Hoppo]

Hi Hils Hoppo,

Some of the information on this thread comes from Ancestry.
If you are using Ancestry and can't find the information, please ask.

But far far from all is from Ancestry!

There is information from the following free sites:

* www.familysearch.org (the IGI and the 1881 England census)
and
* http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ (BMD entries for England)

I have not checked out whether there are any relevant entries on FreeCEN or FreeREG.

Enjoy!

JAP

Thanks Jap1 - I do use familysearch and findmypast but I'll bear you in mind next time I can't find someone!

[JAP1]

Hello again Hils Hoppo,

I believe that Ludolf & Amelia had (at least) not just a son Ludolf but also a daughter Amelia Ann.

From FreeBMD:
Birth: WITKOWSKI, Amelia Ann, June quarter 1851, Hertford (also listed as WITKOPERSKI)
Birth: WITKOWSKI, Male, Sep qtr 1853, Hertford (I suspect that this is Ludolf jnr)

I believe that the death in 1855:
Death: WITKOWSKI, Amelia, Dec qtr 1855, Hertford
is the wife Amelia i.e. Ludolf was a widower when he married Sophia.

Daughter Amelia A WITKOWSKI is subsequently (as I said earlier) found at School in 1861 (in Hatfield Hertfordshire, a Scholar, age 9, born Hertford). And in 1871 (age 19 b Hertford) she is studying at a Training College in Bishops Stortford.

Ludolf (Lewdolf) snr is actually listed as Married in 1891 in Wantage. The letter is 'M' not 'U'; note that the enumerator uses 'S' (single) for unmarried persons.

JAP

[JAP1]

Hils Hoppo,

If you get in contact with the person who has a WITKOWSKI tree on the Web, it would seem to be a good idea to ask for the sources of the information (does he have any BMD certificates?) - certain things just don't seem to gel.

You could also refer him to this thread which would fill in some omissions on his tree.

Incidentally, did you notice the following marriage on FreeBMD (only two names on the page):
Marriage: Amelia Anne WITKOWSKI, Sep qtr 1874, Thirsk; Henry Carter MITCHELL on the same page.
This seems likely to be Amelia Ann, presumed daughter of Ludolph W & Amelia SMALL (Amelia Ann would have been ca 23 at this time). Unfortunately, I haven't found them in the 1881 census ...

Presumably you have seen Ludolph's death on FreeBMD:
Death: Ludolph WITKOWSKI, age 69, Sep qtr 1897, Witney

Also that you have followed his mother Mary Ann (widowed when his father Valentin died in 1828 before Ludolph was born) through the censuses to her death, age 72, in Hertford. Ludolph's widowed mother Mary Ann, you will note, worked as a servant - a title in the family was far from necessarily an indicator of wealth!

JAP

[gwendolen]

My Great Aunt Sophia Walls married Ludolf Withowski in Hastings in 1867 but he is on the 1851 census living in Hertford married to Amelia Small. In 1869 he pops up in Eastbourne marrying Annie Woodhall! I'm sure this is one and the same person as the name is so unusual and the dates of birth match. I can't find death certificates for either Amelia or Sophia that suggest he was twice widowed. Is it possible he divorced his first two wives or do we have a bigamist in the family?

Ludolph was my gggrandfather he died in 1897. Amelia his first wife died of consumption in 1855.

Marry Anne - his mother died in 1872 while working as a nurse assistant.

So he wasn't a bigamist or a divorcee. Hope this helps

[Hils Hoppo]

Hi Gwendolen

Apologies for jumping to the inital conclusion that your gggrandfather was a bigamist!!|blush|

The mystery has all been solved now - I have the certificate for Sophia's death and it appears that she died from 'Placenta Previa' (which probably indicates that she died in childbirth) just a year after she married. I think the child must have been stillborn as I can find neither a birth or death cert for it (stillbirths weren't required to be registered then) He married again just a year after Sophia died - which marriage are you descended from?

[gwendolen]

Hi Gwendolen

Apologies for jumping to the inital conclusion that your gggrandfather was a bigamist!!|blush|

The mystery has all been solved now - I have the certificate for Sophia's death and it appears that she died from 'Placenta Previa' (which probably indicates that she died in childbirth) just a year after she married. I think the child must have been stillborn as I can find neither a birth or death cert for it (stillbirths weren't required to be registered then) He married again just a year after Sophia died - which marriage are you descended from?

I am a descendent of the marriage Ludolph and Amemia. I am fasinated and proud of the Witkowski family, I have been investigating into the name for about 25 years now and I really feel I know them all personally - crazy I know!!

Happy searching

[Hils Hoppo]

Oh I know just what you mean! Mine become like living people to me and I can't begin to tell you the tears that I've shed when I've uncovered tragic deaths etc. You're lucky to have such an unusual name to research, albeit with at least half a dozen variations of the spelling - so much easier than my Jones line!! Good luck and I know you'll find tons of help on this forum. And don't be put off by everyone wingeing about the changes to the site - we're not usually a load of old grumps!!|rant|

[gwendolen]

Hi Jap
Amelia and Henry are on the same page 9Sept 1874) because they married each other on that day. You would not have found them on 1881 census because they sailed to Australia before then.
Count Orlando Witkowski did exist. The Witkowski family was an important wealthy land owner in Poland but had to flee the country during to the revelution. This information has come down 2 idependent branches of the family - without any changes.
Mary Ann was a nurse assistant not a servant