Where to find a will?

[sue2white]

I have posted about this part of my family before.

My 3rd gt grandparents were
Frederick Culliford b1814 Walcot Bath
Eliza Ann ??? b c 1930 possibly Pershore

I have never managed to find a marriage reference for these two and suspect they never married.

They had a string of children starting with Frederick b1851 Bengeworth Evesham to Elizabeth b1868 Greenwich.

I have not been able to work out Eliza Ann's maiden name as she seems to go by two. Her first and last born have her maiden name as Roberts, but all the children in between have her maiden name as Dudfield/Dutfield.:confused:

On 1871 census, she appears to have left Frederick and the kids and is living with a William Bone Finding and a daughter, posing as his wife. She later married him and gave a maiden name of Dutfield.

Around that time, all her Culliford children changed their name to Dutfield, even those who had already married and had families.

The original school of thought for the name change was that the children were illiegitimate, and should indeed have been Dutfields. However it has come to light that there was a will, possibly naming Eliza Ann. I had heard rumours of this from a cousin, stating that the family needed to be Dutfields to inherit, but I'm afraid I didn't go along with this until someone I have recently been in contact with has confirmed there was indeed a will. But despite having a copy that he was sent, he cannot find it!!! He seems to think that the executers were Roberts's. Phew!! Confusion.

So!! As you can imagine I want to get hold of this will. We think it orginated from somewhere in Worcestershire (possibly Pershore). Can somebody point me in the right direction so that I may trace it?? This has been on my mind for ages!!

Thanks...in anticipation
Sue|help|

[Peter Goodey]

Your contacts didn't come via GenesReunited did they by any chance?

What date would the will have been proved - before or after 1858?

[sue2white]

Your contacts didn't come via GenesReunited did they by any chance?

Oh yes.

Don't know about the date of the will. I would assume after 1858, as they all changed their names in the 1870's

Sue:o

[Peter Goodey]

I had a similar experience as you through GenesReunited. Sites tend to gain a certain reputation for a reason :)

Post 1858 wills are easy. They were all (England & Wales) dealt with through the centralised system that still exists today.

In theory you can do it by post but in your case I think you're not too sure exactly who the testator might have been. In these circumstances you need to track down a copy of the probate calendars (indexes).

The master set is at High Holborn but you may find a copy closer to home.

I believe Cambs CRO have a copy but you need to check.

I suppose in practice you'd be better going to London and fitting in some other research jobs on the same day!

[sue2white]

It is actually easier for me to go to London.

Can I just turn up, or do I need an appointment? Pity I was at the LMA last week, could have done a detour!!

Sue

[Peter Goodey]

Yes just turn up. There's irritating airport style security on the door :(

Help yourself to the calendar volumes (watch out for admons and wills being separate in early volumes). There's a handy one hour service to obtain a copy of a will.

[sue2white]

Thank you. |hug|

Trouble is...I'll have to wait a month or two before I can get there. Still I've waited this long....


Sue:D

[sue2white]

Just had a thought??
I do not know whose will Eliza Ann...or indeed any of the rest of the family were named in. Do I need this information to look up a will, or is there some sort of search facility for them for anyone named? I hope it was a Dutfield/Dutfield will, but I cannot be sure. :confused:
Sue

[sue2white]

However it has come to light that there was a will, possibly naming Eliza Ann. I had heard rumours of this from a cousin, stating that the family needed to be Dutfields to inherit

Since I started this thread eons ago, I think have found out a lot about this family of mine. I say think, because I have yet to find this blessed will, but might be getting closer.

Dizzy600 has been absolutely marvellous and has done countless look ups for me at Worcester Archives. Thank you! Thank You! http://freesmileyface.net/smiley/Respect/respect-053.gif (http://freesmileyface.net/Free-Respect-Smileys.html)

However, my search has now moved to London. I think there may be a will mentioning her c1879. The Dutfield in question died in the parish of St Olave.

Peter said

Post 1858 wills are easy. They were all (England & Wales) dealt with through the centralised system that still exists today.

Is there any way I can check post 1858 wills in London without having to visit High Holburn??

Suehttp://freesmileyface.net/smiley/Confused/sorry-20.GIF (http://freesmileyface.net/Free-Confused-Smileys.html)

[Kerrywood]

Is there any way I can check post 1858 wills in London without having to visit High Holburn??
There's a list of District Probate Offices which hold the Calendar at the foot of this page (http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/cms/1226.htm). For the 1890s these should be adequate. I think for dates after about 1943 only High Holborn has the full version.

Alternatively, you can have a 4-year postal search done at York for £5.00, which will include a copy of any probate grant found (see above link).

Kerrywood

[Peter Goodey]

Is there any way I can check post 1858 wills in London without having to visit High Holburn??


In addition to the methods mentioned above, some county record offices or main libraries have the calendars on film. The Mormons also have them on film.

[sue2white]

Thanks Kerrywood & Peter
The Mormans have a film? That may be the way forward.
Thanks again.
Sue :)

[sue2white]

I've just looked at the Family Search site, which I can usually negotiate with ease, but the will section is an absolute maze! There seems no logical order.
Am I doing something wrong?

Sue:confused:

[Peter Goodey]

Perhaps memory has failed me and I've got it wrong :confused:

[sue2white]

I don't think you have it wrong, Peter.
They have plenty of calendars for various counties. It is just difficult to search.
Sue

[Kerrywood]

I've just looked at the Family Search site, which I can usually negotiate with ease, but the will section is an absolute maze! There seems no logical order

I think this (http://www.familysearch.org/eng/library/fhlcatalog/supermainframeset.asp?display=titledetails&titleno=208102&disp=Calendar+of+the+grants+of+probate+and+le%20%2 0&columns=*,0,0) is the entry you want. It's on 542 reels of film, so click View Film Notes to check which film to order :)

Kerrywood

[Kerrywood]

Further to the above, you need to bear in mind that a will can be proved or letters of administration granted several years after the death, so you will probably want to look at more than one LDS film.

Depending on the current cost of hiring LDS films, all other things being equal, it may actually be cheaper to get a postal search done at York for £5.00, which (as I said) covers four years and includes a copy of any grant of probate found.

Of course you do risk losing that £5.00 if there was no grant at all. A delicate balance ;)

Kerrywood

[sue2white]

Thanks Kerrywood.

Sue

[sidney easton]

A will may have come from outside the county, if you know where it came from you may stand a chance of finding it.
It may be that the names were changed in order to claim.
Look for deaths. in the era. Dont forget that many wills were for small personal items and would not have been registerd, but internal of the family, in such cases no records will be found unless the will was contested.
A more recent case was that of an old woman who left her house and contents to the local church. The son of this woman had to fight to get his posesions & co. that were stored within the house. It was deemed that, his mother could not bequeath to another person items that did not belong to her.
If you can find the testator, you can then check the census for persons of the surnames
you have given, a fair indication of money and a will. are the words "Private means or investments" and you can check ten years on to see if the house is occupied by a relative of the deceased. other than knowing the name of the testator you can only hope to get lucky.

[Wirral]

Just had a thought??
I do not know whose will Eliza Ann...or indeed any of the rest of the family were named in. Do I need this information to look up a will, or is there some sort of search facility for them for anyone named? I hope it was a Dutfield/Dutfield will, but I cannot be sure. :confused:
Sue
There is no search facility for beneficiaries. The index is purely an alphabetical index of the deceased persons, published by year that probate or administration was granted. Small value estates may not have needed to go through probate/administration, so a will could exist, but not be recorded in the Probate Calendar.
The only other names in the Calendar are the executors or administrators of estates to whom probate/admon was granted. This doesn't necessarily include all the executors listed in a will. There is no searchable index for executors/administrators whether named in the Calendar or not.

To find out the details of a will - including the names of the beneficiaries - you have to buy a copy of the will. Basically, if you don't know the name of the person who left the will, then it is impossible to find the beneficiaries.

You need that contact of yours to get rummaging!

[sue2white]

Since I posted this thread, I have looked at countless wills in hope of finding Eliza Ann named as a beneficiary. But unfortunately I have not been sucessful. But on 1901 census she is living alone and it states 'Living on own means'.
Her money definitely came from somewhere! But where?
Sue:confused: