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Joanna1
22-09-2008, 8:58 AM
Are there any B-G Members who are familiar with the History in India Himalayas 1906 -1915? As I think 1906 is when my grandfather Humphrey Weaver transferred/joined the Indian Army.

Does anyone know if this regiment had anything to do with Hong Kong in 1906/7 where they there in Hong Kong as this is where he met my Grandmother? Clytie Weaver[/[B]nee Wheeler]

Are there any B-G members familiar with famiy names and place names in Sikkim Gantok, Tibet for these times 1906-19015?

Could anyone kindly tell me please of what the 114th Mahrattas Indian Army was doing on the frontiers of the Tibetan boarder 1906 to 1915 and where they were? I know they were defending the boarders from the Chinese and Russians but there was a lot of involvement with the Dalia Lama in Tibet meetings in Phari 1912 with Captain Leslie Weir and Captain Humphrey Weaver meetings with His Holiness the 13TH Dalia Lama. in Phari

(This is the army list, but I do not know what it means)? I know the 114th Mahrattas was founded 6th March 1800
(Raised 6 Mar. 1800.) Class Company Regiment. 4 Companies Konkani Mahrattas, 2 Companies Dekhani Mahrattas, 2 Companies Dekhan Mussalmans.
(I have been given this, but have not clue how to find out any information could someone please help or advice)? Head Quarters at Dibrugarh. Uniform Scarlet, Facings Yellow. Where is this?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dibrugarh

Could this have been my grandfather’s commanding officer for the 114th Mahrattas Army been COLONEL Iredell, Lieut.-General F. S., 13 May 04? If not who was it?

I believe Humphrey Weaver was in charge of two companies. Double Company Officer, 22 Oct. 95. - But where?

Does anyone know how many officers there would have been, and how many Soldiers in the regiment?

How many altogether would have been on the Tibetan boarders?

Does this website exist? Maybe someone from B-G knows who to ask. India Office research.... http://www.bl.uk/collections/orientaloffice.html


This website does not existing either: Paul Rowland at The Indiaman Magazine.indiaman.com

This is Humphrey's Army History. It seems he joined the Indian army 1906. London Gazette has three entries, 1906-1919:
#27900 publ 3 Apr 1906: Indian Army, to be Second Lieutenant - 2nd Lieutenant H... W..., 114th Mahrattas, from the South Staffordshire Regiment; dated 22nd October 1905 but to rank from 28th Jan 1903'
#27914, 18 May 1906, India Office - promotion 2nd Lieut to Lieut, dated 22nd Oct 1905.
#28463 7 Feb 1911, Lieut to Captain, dated 26 Dec 1910.
I have seen this from The India Office collection at the British Library [[email protected]] has two catalogue refs, one to HW's memorial inscription at Basra, the other to a biographical file.

I thank anyone in advance who will be kind enough to investigate and give me some information my best wishes Joanna

Procat
22-09-2008, 9:51 AM
Hi Joanna,

Cannot help you with your questions except that both the web sites you gave worked for me.

The last one does not work however: I have seen this from The India Office collection at the British Library [[email protected]]

Unfortunately the 'The Indiaman Magazine' site appears to be a commercial site. As such the link is not allowed in the Forum and I have removed it.

Fordy
22-09-2008, 12:22 PM
Hi Joanna,

Cannot help you with your questions except that both the web sites you gave worked for me.

The last one does not work however: I have seen this from The India Office collection at the British Library [[email protected]]

Unfortunately the 'The Indiaman Magazine' site appears to be a commercial site. As such the link is not allowed in the Forum and I have removed it.

The Indiaman Magazine is no longer published, however the research service is still alive & well and turns up by entering 'indiaman' into a search engine
I will point out that I know Paul Rowland [Indiaman] quite well, but this has no bearing on my post.

What Indiaman do would have no direct competition with anything on The Parish Chest, so I do not see anything wrong with posting the website link at all as it was posted in context.
As far as I am aware (Pam put me right on this if I am incorrect) it is the posting of links that are in competition with products & services offered by the Parish Chest, or blatant advertising, that are not allowed. Having invested money to rescue and grow these forums, that is in my opinion only fair and justified.

What irks me is the general remark "...appears to be a commercial site. As such the link is not allowed in the Forum and I have removed it."

COMMERCE: Noun: the activity embracing all forms of the purchase and sale of goods and services.

So that includes The National Archives, FMP, A***y, ALL Family History Societies, S&N & all their sub-plots, just about every forum on the internet that sells advertising either direct or by PPC adwords, all Family History magazines, all Newspapers, all Local archives who sell services, leaflets etc, The GRO who sell you Certficates... the list is endless.

Are these all banned from the forums?

Clarification please Pam.

David.

Geoffers
22-09-2008, 12:49 PM
Direct links to such sites as findmypast, ancestry, etc are not permitted. They are private commercial sites requiring money to gain information.

You are allowed to indicate how to find a site, so I have altered your reply to indicate a means which is permitted (see the italics)

Links are permitted to TNA and the GRO.
Links are permitted to The Parish Chest which is the sponsor of these forums.

Click on FAQ (http://www.british-genealogy.com/forums/faq.php)
Then 'Reading and Posting Messages' and 'Links'

There you will find: - Links to any commercial web sites are NOT acceptable and will be edited/deleted without warning. Also, please do NOT post links to web sites (personal or otherwise) for publicity purposes as these will be deleted. This is a family history forum, not an advertising site for all and sundry.

These are the rules of forum use.

Granted that it can get confusing, if in doubt please ask.

(Edit - I would add that Pam, as owner of the forums may allow/deny mention of direct URLs as she sees fit. If URLs are permitted to particular sites, she will let us moderators know. If she wishes to allow Indiaman URL to be posted directly, I am happy to reinstate it).

Fordy
22-09-2008, 1:07 PM
Direct links to such sites as findmypast, ancestry, etc are not permitted. They are private commercial sites requiring money to gain information.

You are allowed to indicate how to find a site, so I have altered your reply to indicate a means which is permitted (see the italics)

Links are permitted to TNA.
Links are permitted to The Parish Chest which is the sponsor of these forums.

These are the rules of forum use.

Granted that it can get confusing, if in doubt please ask.

I am asking now...

What is the difference between:

"They are private commercial sites requiring money to gain information." and PUBLIC commercial sites requiring money to gain information [eg: TNA etc.]

They are both a]. commercial and b].asking for money to gain information!

I do not see any definition other than "commercial" in the site FAQ.
If a link is posted in context, providing it doesn't compromise The Parish Chest as per rules then I can't see what the problem is. The TNA (and the others I mentioned) provide a service in exchange for a fee - what is the difference? If there is a blanket ban then it should apply to all commercial organisations should it not?

FAQ
Links
Links to any/all non-commercial sites are acceptable and encouraged. Links to commercial/rival sites are not acceptable and will be edited/deleted. Please do NOT post links to web sites (personal or otherwise) for publicity purposes as these will be deleted. This is a family history forum, not an advertising site for all and sundry.

Geoffers
22-09-2008, 1:13 PM
TNA and GRO are both government based sites, official repositories and suppliers. We are advised that links to them are permitted.

findmypast, ancestry, thegenealogist, etc are not government based sites and we are advised that links to them are not permitted.

Fordy
22-09-2008, 1:27 PM
TNA and GRO are both government based sites, official repositories and suppliers. We are advised that linsk to them are permitted.

findmypast, ancestry, thegenealogist, etc are not government based sites and we are advised that links to them are not permitted.

I don't have a problem with either statement and if they are the rules, so be it. BUT the FAQ states "COMMERCIAL" and doesn't differentiate.

The point I am trying to make is that if a website (commerical or otherwise, unless on the banned list) is in context with a research question/statement it should not be unreasonable to allow it to be included.

I await clarification from Pam |bowdown| [I can feel the daggers being sharpened as I type! :) ].

daggers
22-09-2008, 9:29 PM
Ouch! Please leave me out of this!!!
Daggers

Sandyhall
23-09-2008, 8:21 AM
I don't have a problem with either statement and if they are the rules, so be it. BUT the FAQ states "COMMERCIAL" and doesn't differentiate.

The point I am trying to make is that if a website (commerical or otherwise, unless on the banned list) is in context with a research question/statement it should not be unreasonable to allow it to be included.

I await clarification from Pam |bowdown| [I can feel the daggers being sharpened as I type! :) ].

Hi
I'm going to add my two pennyworth to the pot Fordy there is nothing to stop you sending a PM (private message) to give commercial sites names to someone else is there now.
Sandy

Fordy
23-09-2008, 9:22 AM
Hi
I'm going to add my two pennyworth to the pot Fordy there is nothing to stop you sending a PM (private message) to give commercial sites names to someone else is there now.
Sandy


It wasn't my original thread and I didn't post the original link that was removed.
Anyway it has been clarified by Pam |bowdown| and although I don't agree with it in the circumstances of the posting, I will obey :-)

Climbs down from |soapbox|

Fordy.

Joanna1
23-09-2008, 1:56 PM
Ouch! Please leave me out of this!!!
Daggers

Wow that’s all very exciting stuff to get a dispute going with some of the top people of B-G - I didn't know I was that powerful |laugh1|ha ha!

All the same I need help with my first quires please please can some can some one help a humble me? Joanna

Fordy
23-09-2008, 3:25 PM
In Harts 1905 Army List (http://www.parishchest.com/shop/index.php?cmd=listlinkeditems&cat=D6130&supplier=&breadcrumb=Armed+Forces%3AYour+Old+Books+%26+Maps: British+Army+Lists+%28Hart%27s%29+1900+-+2000):


114th Mahrattas.
(Raised 6 March 1800.)
Class Company Regiment—4 Companies Konkani Mahrattas, 2 Companies Deccani Mahrattas,
2 Companies Deccani Mahomedans.
Headquarters at Hong Kong. Depot at Neemuch. Uniform, Scarlet. Facings, Yellow.
Honorary Colonel. Lieut.-General Francis Shrubb Iredell.

Humphrey Weaver is listed with The South Staffordshire Regiment.
Lt. H.Weaver Indian Army.
The 2nd Battalion were at Agra, Bengal.

Joanna1
25-09-2008, 8:35 AM
In Harts 1905 Army List (http://www.parishchest.com/shop/index.php?cmd=listlinkeditems&cat=D6130&supplier=&breadcrumb=Armed+Forces%3AYour+Old+Books+%26+Maps: British+Army+Lists+%28Hart%27s%29+1900+-+2000):


114th Mahrattas.
(Raised 6 March 1800.)
Class Company Regiment—4 Companies Konkani Mahrattas, 2 Companies Deccani Mahrattas,
2 Companies Deccani Mahomedans.
Headquarters at Hong Kong. Depot at Neemuch. Uniform, Scarlet. Facings, Yellow.
Honorary Colonel. Lieut.-General Francis Shrubb Iredell.

Humphrey Weaver is listed with The South Staffordshire Regiment.
Lt. H.Weaver Indian Army.
The 2nd Battalion were at Agra, Bengal.


Thank you very much for this bit of updated information. Does anyone know how to find out or know if there are any addresses that would be able to give me information of the Periods I am interested in 1903/6 to 1915 Himalaya Mountains to trace what Humphrey Weaver was doing? Sorry to be persistent but I'm up against a brick wall. Joanna

Joanna1
25-09-2008, 8:42 AM
No dispute at all, Joanna. We are adults and enjoy a good debate - just as long as I win!!!:cool:


All in fun, said with tongue in cheek thanks for all Pam B-G is amazing. Joanna

Fordy
25-09-2008, 8:57 AM
Thank you very much for this bit of updated information. Does anyone know how to find out or know if there are any addresses that would be able to give me information of the Periods I am interested in 1903/6 to 1915 Himalaya Mountains to trace what Humphrey Weaver was doing? Sorry to be persistent but I'm up against a brick wall. Joanna

The Staffordshire Regiment Museum might be able to help. Other than that, I don't know where to direct you, other than THE INDIAMAN MAGAZINE :-)

Staffordshire Museum
http://x.staffordshireregimentmuseum.com/archives.php

Joanna1
26-09-2008, 8:50 AM
The Staffordshire Regiment Museum might be able to help. Other than that, I don't know where to direct you, other than THE INDIAMAN MAGAZINE :-)

Staffordshire Museum
http://x.staffordshireregimentmuseum.com/archives.php

Thanks, I have written to the Staffordshire Regiment Museum again, no joy last time, now with a up date in Humphreys career they may be able to help, do so hope so. Will let you know if so. I do not know where to go with the Indian Magazine it was initially suggested to me by a B-G member a page comes up with all sorts but nothing I can’t see to anything relevant or any contact details to the right body who can help me. What do I put into Google other than Indiaman, or which page do I click on? I wish I could be as good as you all are at B-G knowing what and where to find information |banghead| sorry if I am stupid, but still at a blank. Terrible when I know Humphrey was important and had a major role there but then I can’t find anyone with any records. Joanna:

Fordy
26-09-2008, 9:17 AM
Thanks, I have written to the Staffordshire Regiment Museum again, no joy last time, now with a up date in Humphreys career they may be able to help, do so hope so. Will let you know if so. I do not know where to go with the Indian Magazine it was initially suggested to me by a B-G member a page comes up with all sorts but nothing I can’t see to anything relevant or any contact details to the right body who can help me. What do I put into Google other than Indiaman, or which page do I click on? I wish I could be as good as you all are at B-G knowing what and where to find information |banghead| sorry if I am stupid, but still at a blank. Terrible when I know Humphrey was important and had a major role there but then I can’t find anyone with any records. Joanna:


Have sent you a PM.

Joanna1
27-09-2008, 12:04 PM
Hi David, or who ever can leand a hand to help me with these websites.

I have heard now from the BL and although they have no records there he advices the below.


With this extra information I can now confirm that as he was originally serving with the South Staffordshire Regiment, a British Army unit, it is likely that his record of service will be held with his British Army files. It was quite common for British Army officers to serve short to medium periods with an Indian Army regiment. In most cases there service records are not held here. If you have not already been in touch with the National Archives (they hold thousands of service files for officers who were in service up until 1920) I would like to suggest that you do so. For the files pertaining to men who continued their service after 1920 please try the Army Personnel Centre in Glasgow. Details of these institutes can be found on their websites which are as follows: www.pro.gov.uk/ and http://www2.army.mod.uk/contacts/divisions/index.htm

I was hoping you would contact me again and I am glad I have been able to lead you to a place where you will hopefully have better luck in tracing your very notable relative.

Would you be so kind as to find the information from these two sites as I get lost. If you are not sucsesful, I will then get beck to BL and say so. as there have to be records somewhere.

Many many thank yous for anyone who can help - I will try any lead.
Have a nice weekend Joanna