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Falcor
22-07-2008, 4:21 PM
I am having some problems with a branch of my family tree in that one of my ancestors 'Olive Jane GURNEY' who went to Singapore and has made tracking her records and children rather difficult.

It would appear that she married twice, as I am told by my mother. One husband was called Otto MULLER and the other was called Edwin KRAAL. I do not know if she married them both in Singapore or which one was first and second husbands. There were two daughters; Miriam and Ranee[sic]. Miriam I have met when I was a child and she was known as Miriam Muller (now deceased - lived in Prestatyn, Wales). Ranee married someone by the name of BAGULEY and I believe there were 2 children from that marriage - possibly a son called Robert? I don't know if Miriam and Ranee were sisters or half-sisters (one from each marriage). It is rather vague all together, I know, but I do want to put some order to this obviously. |banghead|

What I do know is that Olive Jane GURNEY was born in Surbiton, Surrey in ABT June 1875. Mary Catherine KRAAL (Kate) and her son Edwin Robert Francis KRAAL. Mrs KRAAL was the widowed daughter of Robert HENTIG, and was related to the BUSSELLSs and the BOWKERs by marriage – her mother’s second marriage was to John BOWKER. She had a son Edwin who was deaf and dumb. The letters cover the years 1879-1885, when she brought Edwin to England, from Singapore, to be educated at the Deaf and Dumb Institution, Brighton. This was done through the help of her brother Mr N BISHOP, Mrs M BOWKER (grandmother to Edwin) and Mr Tom Arthur BUSSELL and his daughter Frances Susanna. After two years in England Mrs KRAAL and her son returned to Singapore owing to Mrs KRAAL’s ill health.

I know nothing of Otto MULLER other than he was an Austrian? Had some connection with hotels? I am assuming that possibly Miriam was his daughter and that Ranee was the daughter of Edwin KRAAL. But I could be wrong.

So I throw this open to any assistance in the great community forum, in the vain hope that someone somewhere can fix this jigsaw and possibly open up this tree a bit more.

Falcor

bumblebee
22-07-2008, 6:43 PM
Just trying to put a picture together, I know you have probably been through all this a dozen times, but in 1891 Olive and sister Lois are in Scotland. Just wondered if you have checked to see if she married husband number 1 in Scotland.

Bumblebee

bumblebee
22-07-2008, 6:48 PM
She was a servant at Nisbet House and there are some beautiful pictures of it on the Internet.

(Parish: Edrom; ED: 3; Line: 7; Year: 1891)

Bumblebee

bumblebee
22-07-2008, 7:01 PM
Found this on a passenger list.

Mrs KRAAL, D of Departure 26 July 1910 from Southampton to Singapore, Married. (destination port, Java Indonesia)
Also a Mr E KRAAL (Engineer) and an infant KRAAL. (child marked as Female between 1 and 12 years) Ships name 'Vondel'. Travelled second class.

Bumblebee

bumblebee
22-07-2008, 7:19 PM
Sister Laurestina (married name Bachelor) is also on a passenger list in 1934 going to Japan.

Just wondered if any of these dates may hold some clues. (as in coming home for a family event)

Bumblebee

Falcor
22-07-2008, 9:27 PM
Thank you for your input Bumblebee. I have not known of the Scottish connection of Olive and Lois, I must explore this more. Laurestina was my g-grandmother. She married John Justice Batchelor (a scot from Dundee) in St.Andrew's Cathedral, Singapore in 1901. J.J. Batchelor died young and is buried in the Protestant Cemetery in Bangkok. He was an engineer on the S.S.Patani. There is a lot of activity in Singapore with the families at the turn of the 20th Century and I am trying to piece together what happened and profile the families better. My mother went out there on her 21st birthday for a year!. Apparantly the Gurneys started the first European Laundry Business out there. Lois married a John Warren? DANDO (this is another surname I am trying to profile better).

You seem to be quite good at this, and I appreciate your input here. If you have any more tidbits of info (please don't go out of your way) I shall be most grateful. Thank you.

Falcor

bumblebee
23-07-2008, 12:00 AM
Hi Falcor

Just thinking about clarifying a few of the details and wondered if you would be able to see or obtain a copy of Miriam's death certificate as this would have her place of birth on it. I am presuming she did not marry. It might just say 'Singapore' of course.

I don't know what amount of information you have but here is another passenger list detail.

Miriam Muller, (born 1911, so aged 17) departing 18th May 1928 from London to Singapore. Travelling with Ranee Muller. (age 21) The ship was the Atsuta Maru. Miriam gives her address as Singapore Beacon Road and Ranee as St Peter's Kent. Singapore was their last permanent address. For their intended country of residence it says something like Fedm States.

On the same ship is

Otto Muller (aged 43) and Olive Muller, (48) Otto gives his 'Country of which citizen or subject' as Switzerland. There is a tick under this also for Olive. He gives his address as Singapore Beacon Road, and Olive as St Peter's Kent. He is a Merchant. They also give their intended place of Residence as Fedm? States. Under country of last permanent residence there is a column called 'British Possessions' this column is ticked for both Olive and Otto.


Bumblebee

bumblebee
23-07-2008, 12:14 AM
Another passenger list is in 1933 on the ship the Fushimi Maru.

Miriam MULLER, leaving 21st September 1933, from London to Singapore, age 22, and she is a Stenographer, on the same ship is Olive Muller. Miriam gives her address as 'Broadstairs' and Olive as 33 Beacon Road. No occupation for Olive.

Listed with them/underneath them is a Catherine Muller, address 19 Cameron? Road, West Croydon, aged 27. All details same as above. I don't know if this is any relation or not.

Bumblebee

bumblebee
23-07-2008, 12:23 AM
We have Miriam and Olive travelling again in 1947, both using their full names this time on the Ship the Arundel Castle.

Miriam Florence Muller, leaving 6 February 1947 from Southampton to Singapore, she is 35 and a Clerk. Travelling with Olive Jane Muller aged 70. Their last address is 46 Culmstock Road, S.W.11. For their 'Country of Last permanent Residence' there is a mark for both of them in 'England'.

Bumblebee

bumblebee
23-07-2008, 12:30 AM
And then ....I know I am boring you now....The Ship 'Hessenstein'

Miriam Muller leaving 16 November 1954 from Southampton to Singapore. Aged 43, travelling with O J Muller who is now aged 69? so got a bit younger since 1947 and why not. Olive (I presume) gives her address as McGregor Gow? and Holland. Miriam's address is 16 St, Helen's Court, London E C 3.

Bumblebee

bumblebee
23-07-2008, 12:38 AM
An Otto Muller is travelling to Singapore on 16th October 1908, he is a Merchant and gives his nationality as German.

Otto Muller, aged 43, travelling to Singapore on 21st October 1927, he is a Merchant and address is 13 Cornwall Road, Bedford. National of Switzerland.

Bumblebee

bumblebee
23-07-2008, 12:48 AM
This one may be Ranee

Catherine Olive Ranee Baguley, leaving 11th October 1946 from Southampton to Singapore. Aged 40, Married and a Housewife, Travelling with two children (10 & 8) address is South Croydon, on the same list and down as travelling with wife is a Horace Edward Baguley aged 42, address 14 St Augustine's Avenue South Croydon, Occupation Prison Dept.

So in the light of this Ranee was probably known as Catherine on occasion and is more than likely the Catherine on the earlier passenger list and her death registration in 1986 gives her date of birth as 10th September 1906.

Bumblebee

bumblebee
23-07-2008, 12:59 AM
Mrs Baguley, with H E Baguley, and two infants, left 21st September 1938 from London to Singapore. No details given, travelling as Crown Agents.

Bumblebee

bumblebee
23-07-2008, 1:04 AM
So if Ranee was born in 1906, and Olive was in service in Scotland in 1901 - in between these two dates she went to Singapore and married Mr Kraal. I don't know if that is them on the first passenger list. Sometime after that she married Mr Muller.

Bumblebee

Falcor
23-07-2008, 9:24 AM
This is amazing |jumphappy where do you find all this shipping information? I am very grateful.

So Otto was Swiss, not Austrian, Oh well, close I suppose! And now I know the approximate dates for the ages of Miriam and Ranee, which is useful. So Ranee was obviously older than Miriam and possibly the daughter of Edwin KRAAL but this is just speculation - I don't know why I have it in my head that they were half-sisters |doh|. Still, it gives me something more to work on, and a long way to go yet to get this little branch tidied up.

Falcor

e63219
30-04-2009, 2:01 PM
Hi

Was in WA last January reading papers on JTF Bowker the son of Captain John Bowker.

http://www.liswa.wa.gov.au/pdf/mn/bussell/kraal_family(1).pdf

Cheers, Ian