Taken to the Workhouse to die?

[Buckshee]

I've done a few searches on this but cannot find an answer so I'm wondering if anyone can shed some light on this?

In the 1891 census my Gt Grandfather was living in a house in Cardiff with his wife, 5 children and his mother. The census was taken in April of that year and in the September he died of pneumonia in the house. His mother, who was 71, died in December but she was in the Union Workhouse and died of chronic bronchitis.

I assume that when the father died and only the 2 eldest girls (15 & 13) able to work in a laundry when the grandmother got seriously ill she had to go into the Workhouse and died there.

Does this sound right? Was there any free/cheap medical care available outside the Workhouse?

[Peter Goodey]

Sounds about right to me.

Are you familiar with this site?
workhouses.org.uk

Select 'Workhouse Life' and then 'Medical Care'.

[Buckshee]

Yes it was one of the first things I found after a search. It seems to deal with residents but of course my relative would've been one once she went there. I don't think I realised that the hospital inside was the ONLY thing the local poor had.

Something I've only found out this week that my grandfather was also taken there when he was dying. This was in 1948 mind though and on his death certificate only the address was put on there not the name of the place. To avoid embarresment I suppose. I found this out when talking to the nice people at the Glamorgan Records Office (GRO).

By that time though it was a very different beast. The Workhouses had changed to the Public Assistance Institution and of course in 1948 it changed with the formation of the NHS into St Davids Hospital. Funnily enough it was mainly a maternity hospital and my brother was born there 6 years later so the facilities must have been pretty well established but it didn't stop the family feeling that it still had the stigma of the being the old Workhouse though.

Going to the GRO on Monday to look at the 1891 records which they're getting out for me. No records survive from 1948 so that trails now gone cold.

[Mutley]

Good Luck at the GRO and please post back with the information.
We do like to know the results, being a nosy lot ;)

[John Nicholas]

Hello Buckshee,

It was one of the misfortunes of these places that many became geriatric hospitals in the social and medical reforms of more recent years. My grandmother died in one such in Pontypridd in 1971, having always referred to it as the old workhouse. Old people of that generation felt not only the concerns about losing independence that old people still feel today but also remembered when the place had been the workhouse, which was to be avoided at all costs.

John
PS I used to live in Tawelfan, Nelson in the 1960s. One of my main lines also lived in Nelson (Heol Fawr and Tai'r heol) in the mid-19th century.

[Buckshee]

Hello Buckshee,

It was one of the misfortunes of these places that many became geriatric hospitals in the social and medical reforms of more recent years. My grandmother died in one such in Pontypridd in 1971, having always referred to it as the old workhouse. Old people of that generation felt not only the concerns about losing independence that old people still feel today but also remembered when the place had been the workhouse, which was to be avoided at all costs.

John
PS I used to live in Tawelfan, Nelson in the 1960s. One of my main lines also lived in Nelson (Heol Fawr and Tai'r heol) in the mid-19th century.

It's a small world isn't it? but wouldn't like to paint it!

Don't know those streets in the village but then I've only lived there 12 years so early days yet

[John Nicholas]

You must know Heol Fawr - main street and continuing up the hill to the south?

However, Tai'r heol doesn't seem to appear on modern maps and I wasn't familiar with it. From old maps, it appears to be the road or district near the Railway Inn (if that still exists). It's on the south side of the road to Fiddler's Elbow, where the light railway used to cross the road (before my time there!).
John

[Buckshee]

Good Luck at the GRO and please post back with the information.
We do like to know the results, being a nosy lot ;)

Well not really very much info gained I'm afraid. You only get 2 hours from 5 till 7 on a Monday for after hours access I'm afraid and by the time I got the only an hour and a half.

They had two books set aside for me both covering parts of 1891/2. The records are set in 6 month blocks and the one I was interested was the one from Oct 1891 and Mar 1892 (she died in December 91). Incidentally does anyone know when 'Lady Day' is? The records mentioned it month to month.

The books were quite dry but facinating in the accounts of the Workhouse and the details of life captured. I didn't realise that they were still picking Oakum and breaking stones in the place at that date! All the stocks and sales are there to see, what a dreadful task.

The book is split into two section, one for Indoor Paupers and one for Outdoor. These are also in turn split into parishes so its quite easy to track what you're looking for (if you know what one they're from of course). Found my Jane Collins as an Indoor but the only reference it has is for the number of days she had maintenance, 15, and nothing else. That would be correct if she was admitted and died with bronchitis but there was no record of the death or burial which surprised me.

I went to the previous and later 6 months but again nothing else apart from that one entry. One thing I did spot though was the rest of the family showing up as Outdoor Paupers in the following year. It has the name, children, address and the amount money given to them in poor relief for a period of 7 weeks (£2 2s).

I think I will go back and have another look in case I missed anything but I think I was quite good with it. Glad I went though and they really are nice people there.

Mike Collins

[Jan1954]

Incidentally does anyone know when 'Lady Day' is? The records mentioned it month to month.

British name for the Christian festival (25 March) of the Annunciation of the Virgin Mary; until 1752 it was the beginning of the legal year in England, and it is still a quarter day (date for the payment of quarterly rates or dues).

See here for more informtion: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_Day

[Buckshee]

British name for the Christian festival (25 March) of the Annunciation of the Virgin Mary; until 1752 it was the beginning of the legal year in England, and it is still a quarter day (date for the payment of quarterly rates or dues).

See here for more informtion: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_Day

Ah Wikipedia why didn't I think of that, all is now clear thank you.

[Buckshee]

You must know Heol Fawr - main street and continuing up the hill to the south?

However, Tai'r heol doesn't seem to appear on modern maps and I wasn't familiar with it. From old maps, it appears to be the road or district near the Railway Inn (if that still exists). It's on the south side of the road to Fiddler's Elbow, where the light railway used to cross the road (before my time there!).
John

The road that goes over the mountain (every lump in Wales is a mountain mind) towards Senghenydd yes but I didn't know what it was called. Every days a school day. The Railway Inn is still there and does some nice pub grub. Didn't realise that there was a railway that side of the village though. Only recently found out the old passenger platforms for Nelson station (thanks Dr Beeching)are still on the goods railway to the north of the village!

Do you know of any old maps online John?

Mike

[Buckshee]

Good Luck at the GRO and please post back with the information.
We do like to know the results, being a nosy lot ;)

Well not really very much info gained I'm afraid. You only get 2 hours from 5 till 7 on a Monday for after hours access I'm afraid and by the time I got the only an hour and a half.

They had two books set aside for me both covering parts of 1891/2. The records are set in 6 month blocks and the one I was interested was the one from Oct 1891 and Mar 1892 (she died in December 91). Incidentally does anyone know when 'Lady Day' is? The records mentioned it month to month.

The books were quite dry but facinating in the accounts of the Workhouse and the details of life captured. I didn't realise that they were still picking Oakum and breaking stones in the place at that date! All the stocks and sales are there to see, what a dreadful task.

The book is split into two section, one for Indoor Paupers and one for Outdoor. These are also in turn split into parishes so its quite easy to track what you're looking for (if you know what one they're from of course). Found my Jane Collins as an Indoor but the only reference it has is for the number of days she had maintenance, 15, and nothing else. That would be correct if she was admitted and died with bronchitis but there was no record of the death or burial which surprised me.

I went to the previous and later 6 months but again nothing else apart from that one entry. One thing I did spot though was the rest of the family showing up as Outdoor Paupers in the following year. It has the name, children, address and the amount money given to them in poor relief for a period of 7 weeks (£2 2s).

I think I will go back and have another look in case I missed anything but I think I was quite good with it. Glad I went though and they really are nice people there.

Mike Collins

[John Nicholas]

Mike,

I'll send you an email offline.

John