Starter Advice

[Jolly Brewer]

I have discovered that four relations consecutively ran a pub in Worthing, West Sussex but am unable to find anyone in the town (Town Hall, Magistrates Court Office, local newspaper) who holds or knows of anyone holding a record of landlords/puiblic houses in the town. I've been looking from pre WWII to mid 50s against a pub called THE JOLLY BREWER and surnames of BRAZIER, WOOLMORE and STREETER.
I have the same problem with the wife's great grandparents owning now defunct pubs in EAST COWES, Isle of Wight.
Any guidance to set me on the right road would be appreciated.
The other JOLLY BREWER.

[Geoffers]

You could try to trace licencees of pubs through directories (Pots Office, Kelly's, etc).

Also, records created as a result of the Register of Licences (Licensing (Consolidation) Act, 1910 should be held at the local record office (if the records survive).

[Jan1954]

Welcome to Brit-Gen |wave|

Well, The Jolly Brewers is still in existence in Worthing:

The Jolly Brewers,
39-41 Clifton Rd,
Worthing,
West Sussex,
BN11 4DG
Tel: 01903 200 060

Contact them, find out if they are a managed pub or if they are freehold.

If managed, ask for the brewery details and then contact the brewery archives (they all have them tucked away somewhere).

If freehold, see if the landlord/lady knows when it became such and which brewery it was affiliated to prior to then.

Good luck and don't forget to let us know how you get on. |5cups|

[ChrisKelly]

If the pub is the one Jan1954 has identified, it's owned by J T Davies & Sons Ltd (http://www.jtdavies.co.uk/Jolly%20Brewers.htm).
Mine's a pint of cider please.
:D

[Peter Goodey]

You don't mention any dates.

Licensing records from around 1872 may have survived and will presumably be in West Sussex Record Office.

[Jolly Brewer]

Geoffers
Jan1954
Peter Goodey
Firstly, thank you all for your welcome and immediate responses and advice. If I may I'll use this collective reply to answer your questions and ask for further advice. Please excuse the perhaps greeness of some questions.
Geoffers
I believe my grandfather (Tom BRAZIER) was the first landlord of a rebuilt Jolly Brewers in the 20/30s and I know the previous landlord was a George GRAVETT (at 1915 at least). He was succeeded by Jack WOOLMORE (late 30s) and Reg STREETER (post war). Are back copies of Kelly's normally kept in public libraries? The only Record Office I could think of in Worthing was the Town Hall and then the Magistrates Court office on the basis that licences were issued at Court Petty/Quarterly Sessions - no records were held before 1980.
Jan1954
The pub was tied and the brewery in question was the Kemp Town Brewery of Brighton, long time defunct and they were followed by Charringtons in the early 50s. Would Kemp Town Brewery records still exist and where should I start?
Peter Goodey
Thanks Peter, I presume Chichester is still the county town of West Sussex, I'll try for County archives or such.
General question:
Would a local Licensed Victuallers Association likely to still exist or is this an old institution? Thought this might be another source of pub records.
A very grateful
Jolly Brewer

[ChrisKelly]

I would suggest searching The National Archives (http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk). You never know what you might find. I did a quick search for Jolly Brewer and several records were found including "RECORDS OF TAMPLINS BREWERY LTD, BRIGHTON (FORMERLY TAMPLIN AND SONS LTD), AND OF ABSORBED COMPANIES - ref. TAM - date: 1680-1970". A certain Jolly Brewer and a Jolly Brewers are mentioned which may or may not be relevant.
Good luck.
:)

[Jan1954]

Geoffers
Jan1954
Peter Goodey
Firstly, thank you all for your welcome and immediate responses and advice. If I may I'll use this collective reply to answer your questions and ask for further advice. Please excuse the perhaps greeness of some questions.

You're welcome - glad we could offer some help. Don't worry about questions being green - if you don't know the answers, you have to ask the questions :)


Geoffers
I believe my grandfather (Tom BRAZIER) was the first landlord of a rebuilt Jolly Brewers in the 20/30s and I know the previous landlord was a George GRAVETT (at 1915 at least). He was succeeded by Jack WOOLMORE (late 30s) and Reg STREETER (post war). Are back copies of Kelly's normally kept in public libraries? The only Record Office I could think of in Worthing was the Town Hall and then the Magistrates Court office on the basis that licences were issued at Court Petty/Quarterly Sessions - no records were held before 1980.

To hi-jack Geoffers' part of the question - local copies of Kellys and Post Office directories are usually kept in the reference section of the local library as well as in the County Records Office. Some can also be accessed online, and I'm sure that Geoffers will be able to point you in that direction.


Jan1954
The pub was tied and the brewery in question was the Kemp Town Brewery of Brighton, long time defunct and they were followed by Charringtons in the early 50s. Would Kemp Town Brewery records still exist and where should I start?

Kemptown Brewery is still listed and may be contacted at:
Kemptown Brewery
33 Upper St James Street
Brighton
BN2 1JN
West Sussex
Tel: 01273 602521

They should be able to advise where their archives are kept.



Peter Goodey
Thanks Peter, I presume Chichester is still the county town of West Sussex, I'll try for County archives or such.

You may find this link helpful:

http://www.westsussex.gov.uk/ccm/navigation/libraries-and-archives/record-office/family-history/



General question:
Would a local Licensed Victuallers Association likely to still exist or is this an old institution? Thought this might be another source of pub records.
A very grateful
Jolly Brewer

The LVA is still up and running and may be contacted here:

London and South East Licensed Victuallers Association
222 High Street Colliers Wood
London
SW19 2BH
Tel: 020 8540 1275

Good luck in your quest and don't forget to let us know how you get on.

[Geoffers]

local copies of Kellys and Post Office directories are usually kept in the reference section of the local library as well as in the County Records Office. Some can also be accessed online, and I'm sure that Geoffers will be able to point you in that direction.


Try historicaldircetories (www.historicaldirectories.org/hd/) - though the coverage from 20th century is limited.

As others have mentioned, record offices keep collections (The Centre for Oxfordshire Studies on the top floor of the library in Bonn Sq, Oxford has some covering various parts of the country)

The ParishChest (http://www.parishchest.com/) is an online market place for several publishers of directories on CD. There are other companies selling similar products who advertise in family history magazines.

[Colin Moretti]

A helpful guide is Victuallers' Licences by Gibson & Hunter, (FFHS). It lists lots of records for W Sussex up to the 1970s, all held at W Sussex RO, Chichester. I can't say if they will have records for Worthing as I don't know what Petty Sessions Division it comes in.

Colin

[Jolly Brewer]

Jan 1954
Geoffers
Peter Goodey
Chris Kelly
Colin Moretti
Once again many thanks for your help and guidance, which has borne fruit and is leading to what I hope a successful conclusion in West Sussex. I think therefore I owe you all a progress report.

With the exception of the War years, I have the approximate dates of the occupancy of THE JOLLY BREWERS public house in Worthing from the local library, starting with my grandfather's entry in 1923 up to 1956, when my uncle left the establishment,

To Geoffers, Peter Goodey and Colin Moretti - I've established that the West Sussex RO has a copy of "Victuallers' Licenses" and I will need to go there if all else fails.

To Jan 1954 and Chris Kelly - Have not heard anything from either the Kemp Town Brewery or the LVA, therefore, am putting my hopes in the RO at Chichester. I've also established that there are sufficient trade/Kelly/PO directories in the Worthing library to prepare my visit to Chichester, if necessary.

Happy Easter to you all
Jolly Brewer

[Jan1954]

Happy Easter, Jolly Brewer!

Thanks for the update - a bit closer to your goal and I wish you success. |hug|

[Ann E]

[QUOTE= I have the same problem with the wife's great grandparents owning now defunct pubs in EAST COWES, Isle of Wight.
Any guidance to set me on the right road would be appreciated.
The other JOLLY BREWER.[/QUOTE]
Hi, for info on IOW Pubs go to
www.
iwight.com/library/record_office/default.asp
click Databases, scroll down to "ALEHOUSE LICENCES".
HTH, Ann E

[Jolly Brewer]

Anne
Many thanks for your head's up on the IoW Alehouse web page. Sadly one under investigation had not appeared up to 1819 and therefore I'm looking for a list from 1819 to 1919. The other "The Star" a very common name falls into the same time frame.
Again my sincere thanks
Regards
Ken