Puzzles surrounding Hallam 1806, Cooper 1813? marriage in 1839

[revdfg]

There are at least 9 baptisms recorded of children of Thomas Hallam and Sarah in the registers for All Saints Loughborough (according to IGI)

Now I believe the Sarah to be Sarah Cooper from the following marriage:
Marriages Jun 1839
COOPER Sarah Leicester 15 122
HALLAM Thomas Leicester 15 122

The Births/Baptisms of the 9 children are as follows:
EMMA HALLAM
Christening: 12 AUG 1835 All Saints, Loughborough, Leicester
Father: THOS. HALLAM Mother: SARAH

SARAH MANSFIELD HALLAM
Birth: 22 JUN 1837
Christening: 04 AUG 1837 All Saints, Loughborough, Leicester
Father: THOS. HALLAM Mother: SARAH

JOHN COOPER HALLAM
Birth: 15 JUL 1845
Christening: 02 JAN 1849 All Saints, Loughborough, Leicester
Father: THOMAS HALLAM Mother: SARAH

THOMAS HALLAM
Birth: 16 MAR 1848
Christening: 02 JAN 1849 All Saints, Loughborough, Leicester
Father: THOMAS HALLAM Mother: SARAH

FREDERICK HALLAM
Birth: 21 MAY 1849
Christening: 21 JUL 1850 All Saints, Loughborough, Leicester
Father: THOS. HALLAM Mother: SARAH

EDWIN HALLAM
Birth: 28 AUG 1851
Christening: 23 MAR 1857 All Saints, Loughborough, Leicester
Father: THOS. HALLAM Mother: SARAH

MARY HALLAM
Birth: 19 MAY 1856
Christening: 23 MAR 1857 All Saints, Loughborough, Leicester
Father: THOS. HALLAM Mother: SARAH

CHARLES HALLAM
Christening: 15 AUG 1869 All Saints, Loughborough, Leicester
Age at Christening: 11
Father: THOMAS HALLAM Mother: SARAH

Sorry - only 8 children not 9!

The first child born AFTER the 1839 marriage is John COOPER Hallam, so the Cooper looks as if it is his mother's maiden name.

What intrigues me is the two children born before the marriage.
Emma Hallam 1835 carries her later fathers name. Does this mean that she was born out of wedlock and given her natural father's surname? I suppose so.
Then there is the second child Sarah Mansfield Hallam. I wonder if anyone can throw light on the MANSFIELD. I wondered if it might be Sarah Cooper's mother's maiden name? Any ideas.

Finally I wonder if anyone can locate the parents of Sarah Cooper?

Any help appreciated as it may save me from sending for up to 8 birth certificates!!

[Sue Mackay]

1851 census HO107; Piece: 2085; Folio: 162; Page: 18
Penfold Gate, Loughborough
Thomas HALLAM 46 labourer b Notts East Leake
Sarah 38 b Loughborough
Sarah 13 b Loughborough
John Cooper 5 b Loughborough
Thomas 3 b Loughborough
Frederick 1 b Loughborough

1851 HO107; Piece: 2085; Folio: 290; Page: 5
Baxtergate Loughborough
Thomas GREENSMITH 56 Victualler b Nottingham
Elizabeth GREENSMITH 55 b Loughborough
Emma HALLAM Niece 15 b Loughborough

1861 RG9; Piece: 2274; Folio: 11; Page: 15
Penfold Gate Loughborough
Family all there except two eldest girls and with addition of Edwin (9), Mary (5) and Charles (3)

[hughar]

There is a long gap between the first two children and the third child, with the marriage in between. Is it possible that the first two children were from an earlier marriage, and that Thomas' first wife (also named Sarah) died some time between the second child in 1837 and his marriage to Sarah Cooper in 1839?
It should be easy to tell from whether he is shown on the 1839 marriage certificate as bachelor or widower.

[Sue Mackay]

There is a long gap between the first two children and the third child, with the marriage in between. Is it possible that the first two children were from an earlier marriage, and that Thomas' first wife (also named Sarah) died some time between the second child in 1837 and his marriage to Sarah Cooper in 1839?

At first I thought I'd cracked it when I found the death of a Sarah Hallam in Loughborough June qtr 1844, till I realised that was well after the second marriage. Then I realised Thomas had come from just over the border in Notts, and looked at Nottinghamshire as well. There were two deaths registered for a Sarah Hallam Sep qtr 1837 Nottingham, both vol 15, one page 343 and one page 357.

PS Don't know if it fits, but the IGI has a marriage on 24 October 1826 in Nottingham St.Mary between a Thomas HALLAM and a Sarah MAXFIELD. Could this be a transcription error for MANSFIELD?

[HiFly]

Woohoo!! |jumphappy

I've got a small pile of HALLAM's from the Lutterworth area in the early to mid 1700's .....let me know of any interest...

HiFly

[revdfg]

I thank you all for your helpful responses.
Yes it looks as though there may have been a first marriage between Thomas and a Sarah Maxfield. The marriage at St Mary, Nottingham when Thomas was 20 seems reasonably (24 Oct 1826) followed by children in 1835 (Emma's Baptism) and Sarah Maxfield Hallam in 1837 (assuming IGI transcription "Mansfield" is an error). The death of a Sarah Hallam in Sep quarter 1837 suggests a death following the birth of Sarah.

All that ties in nicely. But who on earth are the aunt and uncle of Emma in the 1851 census? If Emma is blood niece of Thomas Greensmith then that would suggest she is daughter of a sister of his who married a Hallam - a brother of Thomas Hallam. That means I need to find out more about Thomas Hallam's siblings in East Leake!!

Alternatively, if Emma is blood niece of Elizabeth Greensmith, that would suggest Elizabeth is in fact Thomas Hallam's sister (with maiden name Hallam). Again it looks like an East Leake serach!!

But the ages of the Greensmiths also suggest possibility that she is great-niece - rather more tricky.

And just to thicken the plot I have found that Emma is still with her "uncle" in 1861:
1861: Angel Inn, Baxtergate, Loughborough
Thos Greensmith, Head, Widower, 67, Inn Keeper, Victualler, Nottingham
Emma Hallam (transcribed as Millam but readable as Hallam), Niece, 25, Housekeeper, Loughborough, Leicestershire
M A Frisby, Niece, 23, Leicester
Ah! another niece - another clue?

Any ideas?

David

[Sue Mackay]

Sarah Maxfield Hallam in 1837 (assuming IGI transcription "Mansfield" is an error). The death of a Sarah Hallam in Sep quarter 1837 suggests a death following the birth of Sarah.


That was my first thought, but not only is Sarah apparently alive and well aged 13 in 1851 but FreeBMD has a marriage of a Sarah MANSFIELD Hallam in Nottingham Dec qtr 1868 vol 7b page 428. Spouse would be either William Morgan or John Smedley

Edit: Looks like SMEDLEY
1871 RG10; Piece: 3529; Folio: 10; Page: 14
1 Parrs Yard Eland St, Nottingham
John SMEDLEY 29 labourer b Stapleford, Notts
Sarah wife 32 seamstress b Loughborough, Leics
Sarah 4 b Nottingham
Mary Ann 2 b Nottingham
2 boarders, Thomas and Emma Robinson

[Sue Mackay]

That was my first thought, but not only is Sarah apparently alive and well aged 13 in 1851 but FreeBMD has a marriage of a Sarah MANSFIELD Hallam in Nottingham Dec qtr 1868 vol 7b page 428.

Have realised I misread your original posting. One of the Sarahs who died in 1837 is probaby yours and she probably died as a result of Sarah Mansfield Hallam's birth. As there were two Sarah Hallams registered a couple of pages apart it was my immediate thought that the baby had died too, but she obviously didn't.

[janbooth]

David,

Here is the family in the 1841 census of Loughborough (mistranscribed as HALLAN by Ancestry):

HO107/595/9, folio 43, pages 9/10
Pinfold Gate

Thomas HALLAM 40 Lace Hand Born in county N
Sarah do 40
Sarah do 6 Y
Emma do 4 Y

Unfortunately, no details for Sarah.

The Notts FHS Marriage Index shows the marriage for Thomas HALLAM to be on 24 October 1826 at Nottingham St Mary to a Sarah MANSFIELD.

In the 1841 census of Loughborough Thomas GREENSMITH is shown as follows:

HO107/595/9, folio 26, page 16
Baxter Gate

Thos GREENSMITH 45 Inn Keeper Born in county N
Elizth do 45 Y
Saml do 14 N

No that this helps you much to discover how Emma is the niece of Thomas GREENSMITH, but it may give you a bit more to go on. Good luck

Janet

[revdfg]

Thank you, Janet. Well spotted - Hallan for Hallam in 1841 census. It looks to me as though as well as that transcription error the enum,erator has reversed the ages of the two daughters. I reckon it should be Emma 6 and Sarah 4.

I am still puzzled by the Greensmith connection - but reckon I need to crack the East Leake Hallams first.

The censuses of '51, '61 and '71 all give his birth as East Leake, Notts. But what year was he born?
46 in '51 suggests 1804-5
57 in '61 suggests 1803-4
68 in '71 suggests 1802-3
so we have a band from 1802 to 1805

So we look at Family Search for his birth in Notts in that period and find several possibilities:
THOMAS HALLAM - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 21 OCT 1801 East Leake, Nottingham, England
Gender: Male Birth: 05 JUL 1801

THOMAS HALLAM - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 04 MAR 1803 Barton In Fabis, Nottingham, England

THOMAS HALLAM - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 22 NOV 1804 Costock, Nottingham, England
Gender: Male Christening: 28 NOV 1804 Costock, Nottingham, England

THOMAS HALLAM - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 22 OCT 1806 Costock, Nottingham, England

Problem: of these the only birth in East Leake is a bit too early to be consistenet with census ages. Barton in Fabis and Costock are adjacent villages and it is possible that Thomas was BORN in East Leake but baptised in a nearby church. I lean towards this possibilty and a date of 22 or 28 Nov in Costock as the baptism.

I really need an East Leake expert to crack this one! Any takers?

David

[janbooth]

David,

I looked on the NFHS Baptismal Index for Thomas HALLAMs baptised in East Leake and came up with the following:

Born 5 July baptised 21 October 1801 Thomas HALLAM son Thomas & Mary
Born 28 June 1808 baptised 3 July 1808 Thomas HALLAM son Thomas & Mary
Baptised 2 February 1815 Thomas HALLAM son Thomas & Mary
Born 7 March 1808 baptised 13 March 1808

[janbooth]

David,

Don't know what happened to the first post, but here is the full text.

I looked on the NFHS Baptismal Index for Thomas HALLAMs baptised in East Leake and came up with the following:

Born 5 July baptised 21 October 1801 Thomas HALLAM son Thomas & Mary
Born 28 June 1808 baptised 3 July 1808 Thomas HALLAM son Thomas & Mary
Baptised 2 February 1815 Thomas HALLAM son Thomas & Mary
Born 7 March 1808 baptised 13 March 1808 Thomas HALLAM son John & Martha

I can't find any burial records on the Burial Index for the first 2 Thomas's, so perhaps there were more than one set of parents named Thomas & Mary??

Not sure whether this will help or confuse the issue!!

Janet

[Sue Mackay]

IGI has a marriage of a Thomas HALLAM to a Mary MARHALL in East Leake on 5 May 1806. Probably the parents of the one baptised in 1808 but maybe a bit late for your Thomas?

[revdfg]

Thank you, Jan and Sue,
I already had a suggestion from another contact that Thomas Hallam's parents could be Thomas Hallam and Mary Marshall. My thesis that the birth was in East Leake and the baptism in Costock in October 1806 then fits in with the marriage of Thomas and Mary in May 1806 in East Leake. So it looks as though Mary was about 4 months pregnant at the marriage - and perhaps the baptism was a quiet affair away from the home church in the next village.
David

[janbooth]

Hi David,

Just to confirm that the marriage of Thomas HALLAM and Mary MARSHALL appears on the Notts FHS Marriage Index on 5 May 1806 at East Leake.

Janet

[revdfg]

Thank you all.
Since the Hallam emphasis ids now on East Leake I wil transfer queries on to the Notts board.

But I would be interested in any offers of cracking my Greensmith puzzle on THIS board.

Thank you again
David