Will from 1580

[Colin Moretti]

Can anyone help with this will please?

It's the will of William Canterton of Kimbridge, Mottisfont, Hampshire, Gent, and dates from 1580; it's written in English. I've been surprised at how much I can make out.

Unfortunately the photocopies I have are not very good but they're the best that the RO could provide. A friend and I have had a go and written in some of our interpretation and I have added the line numbers.

There are two pages:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m1/colinmoretti/WilliamCantertonwillpageA.jpg
and
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m1/colinmoretti/WilliamCantertonwillpageB.jpg

I hope that the quality is good enough,

Many thanks

Colin

[BeeE586]

I have printed it and will try, although the right edge and line 23 are missing. Printed landscape as it was too wide for portrait.

Eileen

[Geoffers]

I'll make a start on the words you don't seem to have interpreted:

line 8:
begins "my best gelding my best bridle .............I give and beqeauth unto Willm GOOD (my?)

line 9:
"grey amblinge nagge called F(u?)she"

line 10:
begins "yooke of my best oxen and the one halfe of all my howsehold (stoofe = stuff?) and goods w(i)thin my howse".

line 11:
"all corne excepted" then the line ends "the other halfe of"

continued....

[Geoffers]

part 2....

line 12:
"saide howseholde stoffe & goods w(i)thin my howse excepte as before as excepted. Item I give"

line 13
"and beqeauth unto Richard CANTERTON my sone, one yooke of oxen one halfe of my corne both."

line 14:
"in the barne and (abode??), three steares of two yeares of aydge and one steare of thre yeares aydge."

line 15:
"one blacke (heckesor?) bullocke of thre yeares aydge. A little blacke or (iron?) greye mare of ii yeares

continued....

[Geoffers]

part 3...

line 16:
"adge and my little greye mare and her cowlte."

line 17:
"my sone one greye amblinge coulte of ii years adge and one quilted doblet of whit fustian."

line 18:
"one other doblet of canves (cutt?) and halfe of my (coyne = poss. meant to be corn) both in the barne and abode provided"

line 19:
"that my said sone Willm CANTERTON doe not came to my (....?) dwelling howse within the"

continued.....

[Geoffers]

part 4...

line 20:
"(Space?) of thre yeares next (followinge???) my dessease to demande his legace aforesaide. That then my"

line 21:
"will as that his portion or legace shalbe equallye devided amonge (fyve?) of my children (.....?)"

I've got to take my dogs out now, unless someone else has a go, I'll have a play with some more of it later.

Geoffers

[Geoffers]

part 5...
a bit more from the will

line 22
"Agnes Ales and Elizabeth my daughters and Richard my sone on to (as?) devided equally (.....?)

line 23:
"so many of them (as/or???) shalbe living and in the meane tyme the same to (......?) in the said (page cut off here on my print off, I'll see if I can read it later on your web-page)

by the way, from earlier, line 6:
"I give and beqeauth unto the Trinytye Church of Winchester (vii?) s(hillings)

continued.....

[Geoffers]

part 6...
You look to have a fair bit of page 2:

from line 4:
"my daughter iii (.eem?) my best shurte, a (dager?) a hanger......."

line 5:
"CANTERTON my sone ii (keene? - looks ot be the same word as in line 4. I'll have a think about this word) ii shurtes a(nd) other doblet & cloake lined w(i)th (b..yes?) a fure coate and wood"

line 6:
"knyfe a velvet girdle & the furniture & my dudgen (ha.led?) (da..?) Itm I give unto Richard CANTERTON."

line 7:
"my sone a stoned coulte. Itm I give and beqeauth unto John CANTERTON my sone my whitt mare"

continued....

[Geoffers]

part 7...

line 8:
"and a (second???) mare colte of one yeare of adge. The residue of all my goods and cattells movable"

line 9:
and unmovable my debts paid and my funeralls daie. I do give and beqeauth tghe same unto"

line 10:
"Mary my daughter whom I do make my executor of this my last will and testament"

continued.....

[Geoffers]

part 8...

line 11:
and I appointe Thomas BUCAN gent and Willm GOODDE to be the (ov(er)seers???) of this my last will"

line 12:
and testament wittnesses to the will makinge. Nich(ol)as BROADFEAL(D?) (Ell...?) GODDEN John"

line 13:
"NOTBY and other."

continued....

[Geoffers]

part 9...

line 14:
"Debts owing by the testator"

line 15:
"in followth viz unto"

line 16:
"Walt DREWE - xii s" (12 shillings)

line 17:
"Willm GOOD - xv s" (15 shillings)

line18:
"Nich(ol)as CRADOCKE - xviii s" (18 shillings)

continued....

[Geoffers]

part 10...

The last bit looks to just be a note about the granting of probate in March 1581

I think that coverfs most of the will that you haven't been able to read, is there anything else in it which I've missed?

I've had another look at page 1, line 23, butt he scan cuts this off, could you rescan the bottom bit of page 1?

What a great will!

Geoffers

[jeeb]

Hi Colin,
I agree with most of what Geoffers has written

9 greye amblinge nagge called Fisher

An ambling horse is the name given to an easily rideable horse with a good gait ie lifts two feet up on the same side together.

15 one blacke heckefor bullocke (0ne black heckesor bullock)

He uses this word a few times. I do not know what a 'heckesor' is, I am not familiar with it in modern agricultral terms. It is most likely a term for its age but may also be concerned with where it is kept ie farm of village and it is being used to identify it.

Cheers Jeremy

[Geoffers]

He uses this word a few times. I do not know what a 'heckesor' is,
I have a recollection that it is an animal that has not bred, it's potential is therefore unknown, in other words it could be worth a lot or not so much.

Geoffers

[Colin Moretti]

Thanks very much, that's most helpful. |bowdown|

Here's line 23:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m1/colinmoretti/WilliamCantertonwillpageAlines21-23.jpg

I must now combine all the efforts and consult friend; there's a story behind the will, with her help I'll write a short note about it and post that.

There's an inventory too, that will appear shortly, if I'm not pushimg my luck too far.

|cheers|

Colin

[Geoffers]

Here's line 23:mmm - I should have explained myself better - there looks to be something written under line 23 which has been cut off, it's that which I wondered if you might be able to scan - or is it cut off on your copy?


I must now combine all the efforts and consult friend; there's a story behind the will, with her help I'll write a short note about it and post that.I for one would be interested to read it.


There's an inventory too, that will appear shortly, if I'm not pushing my luck too far.If it helps, I'll give it a go
Geoffers

[Mutley]

I looked at this thread when Colin first posted it and knew I did not have a hope in hell in helping.

But I have to say now that I am absolutely enthralled..

How on earth do you do it...... so so clever.....

[BeeE586]

Geoffers beat me to it - I got involved with something else. Nothing that I can add or disagree with. Sorry Colin.

Eileen

[Colin Moretti]

- there looks to be something written under line 23 which has been cut off, it's that which I wondered if you might be able to scan - or is it cut off on your copy? I'm afraid it is, at least in the copy I have, I don't know if Margaret has the missing bit; it will probably be necessary to refer to the original again.

More this evening.

Many thanks

Colin

[jeeb]

I have a recollection that it is an animal that has not bred, it's potential is therefore unknown, in other words it could be worth a lot or not so much.

Geoffers

Hi Geoffers & Colin,
Geoffers there is a problem with your suggestion for the meaning of 'Hecksor'. The Will always uses the word to describe a 'hecksor bullock'. A bullock is a casterated male so it's potential for breeding is nil. In line B3 he leaves his daughter Agnes his best bull, note the word hecksor is not used in that case.

Cheers Jeremy

[Colin Moretti]

Here's the line that was cut in half in the two original images.
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m1/colinmoretti/Missingline.jpg
The first complete line here is line 23 from the original image, the next is the divided line. The third line here is line 1 from the second image.

Colin

[Colin Moretti]

Here's the inventory I mentioned in an earlier posting:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m1/colinmoretti/Inventory.jpg
There is a second page but the copy is too poor to read.

Colin

[Colin Moretti]

In St Andrew’s church, Mottisfont, Hampshire, there is a standing wall monument, see photo here:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m1/colinmoretti/Monument.jpg
There are no identifying inscriptions on the monument whatsoever, apart from the date 1584 on the LH plinth on the entablature and the letters IM on the RH plinth and it has not been possible to establish to whom the memorial was erected; the family has always been described as unknown.

The Canterton family were important land holders in the area, appearing in many documents both before and after the presumed date of the monument, and the local manor was in the family until it was sold in 1608. It was hoped that William Canterton’s will might have provided some link between the monument and the Canterton family. No other monument or tomb to William is known.

The jury is still out,

Colin

[jeeb]

Here's the line that was cut in half in the two original images.
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m1/colinmoretti/Missingline.jpg
The first complete line here is line 23 from the original image, the next is the divided line. The third line here is line 1 from the second image.

Colin
Hi Colin,
Missing lines:-

so many of them as then shall living and in the meane tyme the same to demmise in the endde (end) of my offer to this my last will. I give unto Ales (Alice) my daughter thre (3) ? Keine of the best.

Cheers Jeremy

[jeeb]

There are no identifying inscriptions on the monument whatsoever, apart from the date 1584 on the LH plinth on the entablature and the letters IM on the RH plinth

Colin

Hi Colin,
If these letters (probable initials) were written in 1584 then I suspect without seeing them they are more likely to be JM. The letter J would be written like an I then but usually with a small line through the centre so it would look like a small cross.

[Geoffers]

the endde (end) of my offer to this my last will.
I think this reads, "the hands of my ov(er)seers to this my last will.

I correct my interpretation of 'heckesor' to 'heckefor' - having checked, this is an old spelling for 'heifer'

Geoffers

[Geoffers]

A start to the inventory:

1. Two tables, one bord ii forms & ii tresles - xiiii s vid

2. a longe trough ii planks & one bord - ii s vi d

3. a (two?) eared bell kettle of brasse \ - xx s
4. i pott a skillet and (.?) kettles /

5 + 6 (I'll have a go at this later)

continued....

[Geoffers]

part 2...

7. It(em) and iron bar & ii iron pines - v s

8. a pay(r) of Hand irons - vi s viii d

9. an iron (.....?) and a chaine - vi d

10. ii iron hangers ii pay(rs) of pothooks - xviii d

11. a girdiron - vi d

12. vii platters vii potingers ii s(eau?)cers - xiii s iiii d

continued......

[Geoffers]

part 3.....

13. iiii candlesticks - ii s

14. a m(..?)er dish - vi d

15. a torne (..??) (s..?) threde - xii d

16. a cherne and v chessvats - ii s viii d

17. ii payles vi dyshes & spones - xx d

18. iiii tr(e/u?)ndles - ii s viii d

19. iiii tables - iis x d

20. iii booles - xvi d

more in the morning....
Geoffers

[jeeb]

I think this reads, "the hands of my ov(er)seers to this my last will.

I correct my interpretation of 'heckesor' to 'heckefor' - having checked, this is an old spelling for 'heifer'

Geoffers

I think you are probably right Geoffers, I think it does say overseers.
I pondered that word for quite a while but now you have suggested it I agree.

With regards to Heckefor, it still doesn't make sense. A heifer is a young female cow whereas a bullock is a casterated male. This is the present day meaning. I wonder if there was perhaps a slight derivation of the meaning in 1580

[Colin Moretti]

Thanks everyone for the continuing input.


Hi Colin,
If these letters (probable initials) were written in 1584 then I suspect without seeing them they are more likely to be JM. The letter J would be written like an I then but usually with a small line through the centre so it would look like a small cross.It has been suggested that this is the maker's mark. I've not seen the monument myself so can't say whether it has a cross bar through it or not but I can't see one on close inspection of the photo. I shall enquire.

Colin

[Colin Moretti]

I correct my interpretation of 'heckesor' to 'heckefor' - having checked, this is an old spelling for 'heifer'
With regards to Heckefor, it still doesn't make sense. A heifer is a young female cow whereas a bullock is a casterated male. This is the present day meaning. I wonder if there was perhaps a slight derivation of the meaning in 1580I've had a look at the entry for heifer in the OED. While one of the authorities that it quotes asserts Heifker, a heifer. This is the pronunciation of the word, whatever may be its orthography there is another quotation from a will of 1584 A blake bulloke otherwyse called a Hayfer, exactly the same usage as we have in this will. It would seem that the modern meaning of heifer is more restricted than in the 16th C.

Colin

[Colin Moretti]

I've now checked the OED for the meaning of bullock: Orig. a young bull, or bull calf; but afterwards, and in later times always, a castrated bull, an ox.

Colin

[jeeb]

Hi Colin,
Thankyou for that information. I am closely connected to modern day agriculture and know today bullock & heifer are opposite sexes. I had tried extensively to find a meaning for 'heckfor' without success. I think that one of the problems encountered today by genealogists is the assumption modern day words aways had the same meaning when used by our ancestors, a step son being referred to as a 'son in law' is a classic example.
Looking at old wills & documents gives a good insight into how calligraphy, names and spellings have changed over the years and is a worthwhile exercise for all those wishing to research their ancestory. Very interesting Will Colin, thankyou for allowing us to share it with you.
Cheers Jeremy.

[Colin Moretti]

Very interesting Will Colin, thankyou for allowing us to share it with you...I know that my friend Margaret is particularly appreciative of all the effort that has been put into this, particularly by Geoffers. I'm sure that if she were writing this she would add |hug| all round, I certainly got a very grateful one when I visited her with the will yesterday.

Colin

[Geoffers]

next bit of the inventory.....

21. An iron bounde busshell & A (sode???) rod - xx d

22. ii trevets of iron - v s

23. ii brests of beffe at the roofe - ii s

24. a black ball & i other ball - xx d

25. a hedg(..?)y ball - iiii d

continued.....

[Geoffers]

part the umpteenth....

26. a pepp(er) corne and a seve - ii d

27. ye hangings in the hall - ii d

28. S(u)m (total) iiii li xv s x d

29. In the plure (prob. parlour)

continued......

[Geoffers]

part the last....

30. The hangings - ii s

31. a cubberd - ii s

32. a table ii trestles ii formes a p(o??)st \
planke a shelfe bourd / iiii s

I'm jealous - How come my mob never left such interesting documents????
I know that you wrote tghat the next bit is vey poor, but if you want to post it on photobucket on the offchance, I may be able to makle something out.

Geoffers

[Colin Moretti]

I'm jealous - How come my mob never left such interesting documents????
I know that you wrote that the next bit is very poor, but if you want to post it on photobucket on the offchance, I may be able to make something outNot my mob either!

Who am I to deny you the pleasure, Geoffers? Try this for size:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m1/colinmoretti/Inventorypage2b.jpg

I'll see if I can improve the image or, later this week, check if Margaret has a better one.

Were you able to make anything of lines 5 & 6?

Colin

[Geoffers]

Were you able to make anything of lines 5 & 6?
line 5:
Itm a spitt a dr...?, and a fleshook & a knife - ii s vi d

line 6:
Itm a frieng (i.e. frying) pan - x s id


Glad you posted the additional page of the inventory as it is really interesting, I haven't been able to read it all, but read on for what I can make out at the moment........

continued......

[Geoffers]

Inventory page 2:

1. An olde gowne of (wide?) \ xx s
2. blacke linin /

3. a duche cloake wth \
4. a cap of velvett and |
5. laced with a claps (I think this should read 'clasp') of silver / xl s

6. a (redde?)cloake wth a \ xx s
7. cape of velvett /

continued......

[Geoffers]

Inventory page 2 - part 2

8. ii (cassuch? - poss cassocks?) of mockade \
9. wth a frenge and lace / xxvi s viii d

10. a dublett of silke \
11. (.....?) / xx s

12 an old satte(n??) dublett - x s

13. an old ch..blett? jacott - (..?) iiid

14. ii old jacotts of \ x s
15. fustenne /

continued....

[Geoffers]

Inventory page 2 - part 3.

16. iii old cotts of bread \
17. clothe / xviii s

18. ii payer of cases and a \
19. fr...? (.....?) / xviii s

continued....

[Geoffers]

Inventory page 2 - part 4

20. Of plate

21. a silver goblett duble \
22. gilte weinge (i.e. weighing) xxiii onz (i.e. ounces) / vi li xviiis
23. estimation

24. one other standinge boule \
25. duble gilte weinge xiiii onz / iiii li iiii s

continued.....

[Geoffers]

Inventory page 2 - part 5.

26. One litle boule duble \
27. gilte weinge vii onz and |
28. a quarter / xliii s vi d

29. a salte duble gilte \
30. weinge viii oz a quarter / xlix s vi d

continued.....

[Geoffers]

Inventory page 2 - part 6.

31. a silve goblett (pcell?) \
32. gilte weinge xvii oz at |
33. v s the ounce / iiii li vi s iiii d

34. a silver boule pcell gilte \
35. weinge xi ounces / lvii s vi d

continued.....

[Geoffers]

Inventory page 2 - part 7

36. a silver cuppe pcell gilte \
37. weinge xvii ounces / iiii li vs

38. (This line is cut off, it appears to begin)
a silve salte pcell gilte.

Any more under line 38??

Geoffers

[Colin Moretti]

Any more under line 38??

GeoffersMuch thanks for all your hard work Geoffers.

There's no more in the copy that I have, I shall check today and report back. Certainly it looks as if there should be. It may be that I shall have to go back to the original again, perhaps later this week.

Colin