General help on death of a soldier

[Julie Tyrell]

I have a found on the 1837online site a couple of soliders who died in WW1, which I believe are relatives. What I need to know is how I find out more information about them to confirm this, i.e. dates of birth; any know family etc

I have checked the CWGC site and this doesn't have any more information that what I have gained from 1837 online.

Please can someone tell me where I go from here,

thanks Julie

[sandiep]

Have you tried the 1901 census to see if they are listed?

the certificates would give you more info but at £7 a time I suppose its a dear way of finding out.

have you looked at the medal rolls

sandie

[Julie Tyrell]

re: one of soldiers, I do not know when he was born.

A 'Isaac Albert Lewis' was married to my g.aunt. I have found the listing of a Isaac Albert Lewis who died in 1917 in Flanders. At this stage I have no other information and trying to confirm that it is the same person.

How do I look at the medal roles.

Thanks Julie

[sandiep]

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/

go here to National Archives scroll down to Family History this will take you to WW1 Medal Rolls word of warning it does cost £3.50 if you want to download index is free..........now I found them useful but some people have been dissapointed with what is on the cards.

at least if you sent for the death certificate it might give some more detail

would he have been married in 1901?

sandie

[Julie Tyrell]

Thanks Sandie

Not sure if married in 1901

He had a daughter in 1912, who was an only child as far we know!! That is why I need his date of birth and if possible his wifes name.

I will take a look at the National Archives,

Julie

[sandiep]

Lewis Isaac Albert Andover 2c 224

found this one on FreeBDM

might be a possible

sandie

[Julie Tyrell]

Thanks Sandie

I have absolutely no idea where he came from, with this side of the family coming from Mars is quite possible. This the most intriguing and frustrating family (see my other thread on Daisy Freda Mabel Lewis Howse).

I do appreicate your help
Julie

[Geoffers]

He had a daughter in 1912, who was an only child as far we know!! That is why I need his date of birth and if possible his wifes name.
1837online includes where he enlisted and place of residence - as he had a child shortly before the war, have you been able to trace her on the GRO index and where she was born? If so, does this match up?

When and where did your chap get married to your gt aunt - does this match up with the place of enlistment and residence? Have you seached any directories post-WW1 to see whether your great aunt is listed - or if the head is Isaac Lewis (which would suggest it is not the same chap.

Did his dad outlive him - and leave a will in which he mentions his daughter-in-law and granddaughter?

Geoffers

[Julie Tyrell]

Geoffers

His daughter was born in Kingston, I tried to checked the 1901 census and there are a lot of Isaac Lewis but none from Kingston. So I considered that this may be where the mother Daisy Elizabeth Gibbons came from but can't find her either.

Think I need to sleep on it, as this family have given me a headache !!!

Thanks for tha advise

P.s. can i check Wills on-line??

[Geoffers]

His daughter was born in Kingston,
Which handily matches up with information on the wardeaths part of 1837online, so this is looking hopeful


I tried to checked the 1901 census and there are a lot of Isaac Lewis but none from Kingston.
His birthplace is shown on the 1837online record which helps to narrow down the seach. There's an entry on freebmd for a chap born 1882 in Andover RD - close enough to be a posible match for your chap. So, you have what may be a rough year of birth for him to try and narrow down a 1901 census search for him - I looked and couldn't see him, maybe he joined the army for the South African (Boer) War?

continued.....

[Geoffers]

part 2.....


So I considered that this may be where the mother Daisy Elizabeth Gibbons came from but can't find her either.
There's one aged 16 living in Tooting, which is again a nice match for information on the war deaths part of 1837 online. Who were her parents? Are they shown as living in Tooting too??


P.s. can i check Wills on-line??
No, it can be seen at record centres and local studies' libraries - phone to see if they hold it on microfilm

Geoffers

[Terry Reeves]

32719, Private Isaac Albert Lewis. 12th Battalion, East Surrey Regiment.
Born Salisbury, Wiltshire. Enlisted, Kingston-on-Thames, Surrey. Resided , Tooting. Killed in action, 7.6.17. No known Grave. Commemorated on the Menin Gate Memorial, Ypres, Panel 34.

Sources: Soldiers Died in the Great War and Commonwealth War Graves Commission.

Terry Reeves

[Julie Tyrell]

I haven't been able to ascertain that yet.

Isaac Albert LEWIS married Daisy Elizabeth GIBBONS, producing a daughter Violet Flora LEWIS in Jan 1912, in Wimbledon.

This is were the story gets complicated....

My nan was born Daisy Freda Mabel Lewis HOWSE in Feb 1920 (Ramsgate) to Frederick Thomas HOWSE - Margaret LEWIS.

In April 1921 Eric Thomas HOWSE was born to Frederick Thomas HOWSE and Daisy Elizabeth HOWSE (formerly LEWIS), in Ramsgate. Eric died in 1922.

So Violet and Eric have the same mother different fathers, yet there is only 1 year between Daisy and Eric.

Daisy was bought up by her Aunt (in Ramsgate) as her parents had died.

With no trace of a marriage between Margaret Lewis and Frederick Howse and no deaths that match them, it is all very intriguing.

It seems a big coincidence that Isaac Albert and Margaret are both LEWIS.
I know the aunt was Florence HOWSE married to a Francis Henry Bryan.

So I am trying to trace any possible link that lead back to Daisy Howse's parents.

[Guy Etchells]

Soldiers Died CD

Regiment -East Surrey Regiment
Battalion - 12th battalion
Surname - LEWIS
Christian names - Isaac Albert
Born - Salisbury, Wilts.
Enlisted - Kingston-upon-Thames, Surrey
Residence - Tooting, Surrey
Died date - 07 June 1917
Died How - Killed in Action
Theatre of War - France & Flanders
Rank - Private
Number - 3219

Does that help any?
Cheers
Guy

[Geoffers]

Isaac Albert LEWIS married Daisy Elizabeth GIBBONS, producing a daughter Violet Flora LEWIS in Jan 1912, in Wimbledon....Daisy Freda Mabel Lewis HOWSE in Feb 1920 (Ramsgate) to Frederick Thomas HOWSE - Margaret LEWIS.....1921 Eric Thomas HOWSE was born to Frederick Thomas HOWSE and Daisy Elizabeth HOWSE (formerly LEWIS), in Ramsgate. Eric died in 1922.
So, three half siblings born to two fathers and two mothers! Do you know what happened to Voliet Flora LEWIS? - Did she get married??

Geoffers

[Julie Tyrell]

I must say a BIG thank you to all the people who have helped me to knock down another small brick, with your help I have found the marriage of Isaac Albert Lewis to Daisy Elizabeth Gibbons in 1904 (Wandsworth). Also, I think I have their births too.

I am not sure how much any of this information will help me trace/identify Frederick Thomas Howse and Margaret Lewis, but I think it is strange coincidence that Isaac and Margaret were both LEWIS. I wonder if Daisy E GIbbons had a relationship with her sister-in-laws husband!!!

To Geoffers:

Yes Violet Flora Lewis married Reginal Ernest Bolt in 1937, in Hastings. Her father was recorded as deceased, which would tie in with the Isaac Lewis killed in WW1.

Thanks again
Julie

[Geoffers]

Yes Violet Flora Lewis married Reginal Ernest Bolt in 1937, in Hastings. Her father was recorded as deceased, which would tie in with the Isaac Lewis killed in WW1.
Good, and by any chance was her half-sister a witness at the wedding??


I think it is strange coincidence that Isaac and Margaret were both LEWIS. I wonder if Daisy E GIbbons had a relationship with her sister-in-laws husband
Or perhaps, Isaac and Margaret were siblings/cousins? Have you been able to identify Margaret in any census returns?

continued......

[Geoffers]

part 2.....


With no trace of a marriage between Margaret Lewis and Frederick Howse and no deaths that match them
In checking the GRO index for a marriage, do remember to bear in mind possible clerical error, e.g. mistakenly recording a name as LEWES instead of LEWIS, or HOWES/HOUSE instead of HOWSE. Check for all combinations of names containing Frederick Thomas, and all entries containing a Margaret (she may have had another first name).

Although this may seem silly, in looking for a death of Margaret LEWIS/HOWSE, don't forget to check for a death before the daughter was apparantly born! No, I'm not cracking up.....if Daisy Freda etc born 1920, was born within 6 weeks of the end of the quarter, she may appear in the following quarter's returns - e.g. if she was born in September, she may appear in the December Quarter. If her mum had died in childbirth and buried soon after, her death may have been recorded first and appear in the September quarter. Thus making it seem like the mother died before the daughter was born.

Geoffers

[Julie Tyrell]

As to the witnesses at Violet and Reginal's wedding I do not recognise any of the names (M. C. Dale and L W N Phillips). She was living at Oak Lea, Silverhill Park, St Leonards on Sea (I will look into this, maybe a children's home?) as a Domestic servant.

Violet lived her life in Hastings, with who I dont know, as her father had died and her mother was off having a child in Ramsgate with supposedly a new husband!!

I have found Isaac A Lewis of the 1891 and 1901 census, he was born in Andover, which ties in with his miltary record that stated Salisbury (very close to each other), there is no sister Margaret unfortunately, but as you said could be a cousin.

Still struggling with Margaret Lewis and Frederick T Howse, will keep looking and checking.

Julie

[Julie Tyrell]

A new thought!!

I now know that Isaac Albert LEWIS was killed in action in WW1.

Would his wife of received a war pension?

If she did get a pension was it for all of her life or only until she remarried?

If she died (without getting remarried) did it go to the children??

This a completely new area to me and I have no idea about these matters.

Thansk again!!
Julie

[Geoffers]

I now know that Isaac Albert LEWIS was killed in action in WW1. Would his wife of received a war pension?
I believe that those who enlisted for the length of the war were not entitled to a pension.

TNA's research guide indicates the following source, which may/may not be useful:
Soldier's Effects Ledgers at the Museum of Army Transport
the relevant records for the First World War are now available but stored off-site at the Museum of Army Transport in Bevereley, Yorkshire (two Soldier's Effects ledgers are held at the National Army Museum, but these cover earlier periods). There is no access at the Museum of Army Transport for the public but the National Army Museum will search on behlaf of a reader for a £10 fee. The turnaround time can vary as it is only worthwhile for them to go up when they have enough enquiries to jusify a trip/overnight stay. It is impoprtant to note that the ledgers are less detailed often recording only the next of kin as stated by regiment OR by will, date of death and cause of death.

Geoffers

[peter nicholl]

I believe that those who enlisted for the length of the war were not entitled to a pension.

TNA's research guide indicates the following source, which may/may not be useful:
Soldier's Effects Ledgers at the Museum of Army Transport
the relevant records for the First World War are now available but stored off-site at the Museum of Army Transport in Bevereley, Yorkshire (two Soldier's Effects ledgers are held at the National Army Museum, but these cover earlier periods). There is no access at the Museum of Army Transport for the public but the National Army Museum will search on behlaf of a reader for a £10 fee. The turnaround time can vary as it is only worthwhile for them to go up when they have enough enquiries to jusify a trip/overnight stay. It is impoprtant to note that the ledgers are less detailed often recording only the next of kin as stated by regiment OR by will, date of death and cause of death.

GeoffersI am not too sure how up to date the TNA info. is, but I tried to visit Beverley last year and the Museum had "gone away". Most annoying as they also had records for the Army's Navy. I was told that their "stuff" was at the Royal Armouries, Leeds. But I haven't checked. I'd love to hear if they are up and running again.
Peter
PS Just checked, it's flagged "Permanently Closed", sorry.