View Full Version : Williams, John b June 2 1747 Llanelly, Brecon, Wales

24-07-2008, 3:58 AM
Williams, John b June 2 1747 Llanelly, Brecon, Wales, he was a red head from Brecknockshire who had been sentenced to 14 years transportation (convict ship Duke of Portland 1807) after deserting 35th Sussex Regiment.

I am trying to find John's parents and any siblings.

Up to present day, no one can conclusively say who his parents were.
William Williams and Ann Jones were the parents of John Williams. But have found no proof to confirm this.

There were approximately 49 possibilities who might be candidates for his parents.

John Nicholas
24-07-2008, 2:22 PM
Hello tiggerbrat,

When did he desert? He would have been 60 in 1807 - did they take their time in catching up with him? Or are the details a little suspect?


25-07-2008, 3:12 AM
Sorry I mistyped year John Williams born June 2 1787 I have no details about his deserting
John Williams was a convict who to arrived at Port Jackson aboard the " Duke of Portland" on the 27th July 1807. Prior to his sentence he was a private in the 2nd Battalion of the 35th Regiment of Foot, but had deserted twice and on the 22nd April 1806 was tried at Chichester Barracks in Sussex, and convicted of sedition and desertion. He was sentenced to 14 years transportation to the colony.
After serving nearly 10 years of his sentence he was granted a Conditional Pardon in 1816.

25-07-2008, 3:14 AM
John Williams' place and date of birth will almost certainly be impossible to determine. Historically, the Welsh had used a patronymic surname system meaning that the surname for each generation was derived from the given name of the person's father. This means, for example, that William Thomas' son John would be called John Williams, while John Williams' son Robert would be called Robert Jones, and so on. For this reason, surnames deriving from given names (like Thomas, Williams, Roberts &c) are the most common Welsh surnames, and the name John Williams is as common as the English John Smith.

John Nicholas
25-07-2008, 2:27 PM
John Williams' place and date of birth will almost certainly be impossible to determine.

Now I'm really confused! You mentioned a place and date in your first posting, albeit with a typo - where did they come from? The thing to be aware of about patronyms is that they disappeared over quite a long period, depending which area of Wales you are interested in. John Williams isn't the easiest name to track but it should not be impossible if you have some kind of a lead, such as the place and date you mentioned before.


26-07-2008, 12:35 AM
I have been given details from other people researching same family line

John Nicholas
26-07-2008, 8:48 AM
Are they willing to cite and discuss their sources?


27-07-2008, 3:24 AM

[1] Information from numerous descendants: original source uncertain.

[2] List of deserters from The Hue and Cry, or Police Gazette 5 April 1806; War office – Service Returns: 35th Regiment [PRO ref: WO25/1126]

[3] This detailed research was undertaken by descendant Alby Williams.