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  1. #1

    Default Searching for Henry Alfred Hillman

    I am new to the forum so apologies in advance if I do not comply with formats understood by others!
    I am researching my great uncle Henry Alfred Hillman in the First World War. He did his best to persuade his family to destroy all evidence of his war record after his death in 1946.
    I have found no trace of him through Army Records Research in Scotland.
    The two best pieces of information I have are as follows:
    1. A postcard he sent to more than one family member of himself in uniform, stating on the back - “Private H.A. Hillman, 205857 (or most likely W5857), Section 3, School of Cookery, Cavalry Barracks, York, 1/9/17”.
    2. My late father recalled that his uncle "Alfie" was a strange man as the result of his war experiences, he had been gassed, and he had served in Russia (British Expeditionary Force?). He went to Australia in 1932 to "try to forget it all" but returned a year later.
    Exhaustive research on my part over the past decade or so in medal records etc., has produced no plausible results. Any help or advice would be much appreciated. With thanks - Jesse C. Hillman

  2. #2
    Super Moderator christanel's Avatar
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    Welcome to British-Genealogy

    I have been searching the Medal Roll Index Cards for your great Uncle but can't see one for him. Of course if he didn't apply for his medals then there won't be one. Unfortunately because more than 60% of WW1 service records were destroyed by bombing/fire in WW11 the Medal cards are usually the only remaining record. I can't see a service or pension record for your man either. These are available on ancestry and Findmypast which are pay per view sites.
    At the moment ancestry is allowing free search and viewing of the Medal Roll index cards until the end of the year so you can search yourself and see if you can find what I can't.

    As for the voyage to Australia I can see an H A Hillman leaving England in 1923 and returning the same year- born 1894. There is an H A Hillman returning to England in 1934 age 40 so also born 1894 The 1934 H A Hillman is a Newsagent returning to Elm Cottage Burgh Heath Surrey.
    Sometimes paranoia is just having all the facts.
    William Burroughs

  3. #3

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    Where did he die? Is that him aged 52 in Surrey?
    Why were you searching Scotland?

  4. #4

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    Hi Christanel
    I appreciate your rapid response and suggestions. Many thanks!
    Sadly I had come to the same conclusion with respect to the medal cards and the service record. His must have been one of those lost in WWII and presumably as the war was so horrifying to him he did not want the reminder of the medals.
    I had found the passages to and from Australia. But that is it - brickwall! I do have some Post Office leads since he was also a postman driving a small van (I have photos).
    My main concern was to find where he had served, and especially the Russian part. That campaign seems very confused from what I can find on the web, and since I do not know what regiment he was with I can get no further.
    Anyway, my thanks and best wishes for your efforts. Chris chillman1948
    Quote Originally Posted by christanel View Post
    Welcome to British-Genealogy

    I have been searching the Medal Roll Index Cards for your great Uncle but can't see one for him. Of course if he didn't apply for his medals then there won't be one. Unfortunately because more than 60% of WW1 service records were destroyed by bombing/fire in WW11 the Medal cards are usually the only remaining record. I can't see a service or pension record for your man either. These are available on ancestry and Findmypast which are pay per view sites.
    At the moment ancestry is allowing free search and viewing of the Medal Roll index cards until the end of the year so you can search yourself and see if you can find what I can't.

    As for the voyage to Australia I can see an H A Hillman leaving England in 1923 and returning the same year- born 1894. There is an H A Hillman returning to England in 1934 age 40 so also born 1894 The 1934 H A Hillman is a Newsagent returning to Elm Cottage Burgh Heath Surrey.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lesley Robertson View Post
    Where did he die? Is that him aged 52 in Surrey?
    Why were you searching Scotland?
    Hi Lesley - many thanks for responding.
    Yes, he died at Epsom Infirmary in Surrey.
    I should have been more specific - I paid to locate his service record from the office in Scotland. Sadly no trace, so presume his was one of the records burnt in WWII.
    I shall continue trying all avenues.
    Thanks - Chris chillman1948

  6. #6
    Famous for offering help & advice simmo1's Avatar
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    HI

    Other ranks did not have to apply for their medals, they were automatically sent.
    You have probably answered your own question on them though, if he was in - School of Cookery, Cavalry Barracks, York, 1/9/17 - then maybe he did not serve overseas, and thus would not be entitled to any medals.

    regards

    Robert

  7. #7

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    Hi Robert
    Many thanks for the observations. However, as I said he did serve overseas, being gassed - one presumes in mainland Europe, and he served on the Russian Front - I presume with the BEF that continued after the 1918 peace in the rest of Europe.
    If he had only served at the York barracks in the cookery school, I somehow hope his experiences would not have been as horrific as the family have made out! He really was very psyched by it all, hence the attempt to get away from it all years later in Australia.
    However, thanks for the thoughts. Best wishes chillman1948
    Quote Originally Posted by simmo1 View Post
    HI

    Other ranks did not have to apply for their medals, they were automatically sent.
    You have probably answered your own question on them though, if he was in - School of Cookery, Cavalry Barracks, York, 1/9/17 - then maybe he did not serve overseas, and thus would not be entitled to any medals.

    regards

    Robert

  8. #8

    Default

    Like the others, I can't even find him on the medal index cards (and I checked Anc and FMP). I'm now beginning to wonder whether he was still in the army at the start of the 1920s (quite a lot of soldiers didn't get out in 1918), in which case, the MOD may still be sitting on his records.
    See the message HERE.

  9. #9
    SueNSW
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    Didn't Chris say in an earlier post that the records centre in Glasgow had been tried already to no avail

    Even if a man continued to serve into the 20's he should still have a medal card for WW1 service if he served overseas

  10. #10

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    Jesse,
    Henry Alfred Hillman is in the 1911 census at Elm Cottage but neither he nor the other Hillmans of Elm Cottage are recorded in Banstead All Saints book of men who had served overseas. The book is pretty comprehensive and I think that suggests he had either moved away or he didn't serve abroard at all.

    Your namesake, Jesse (probably Henry's brother as the elder Jesse would have been pushing 60 at the time), was still in Banstead in 1917: he finished 4th in his category (the toughest one, for those who had already won a first prize in the past) in a ploughing match. He represented his employer, Mrs Colman, of the Colman's Mustard family, of Nork Park.

    I know it's just another negative to add to the pile but I hope that helps in some way,

    James

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